4 year old female is squeaking when urinating

duskern

Post   » Tue Oct 16, 2018 6:49 am


Recently we have heard some squeaking from Abigail again. Not that much, and not every day. It has actually been some days since I last heard it. I am of course afraid that it has something to do with the bladder stone.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:45 am


I hope not too, though it is the most likely cause. Not rereading, but can you summarize the changes you have made to help her deal with stones?

Bookfan
For the Love of Pigs

Post   » Tue Oct 16, 2018 1:47 pm


We have a stone-prone pig & the vet prescribed diazepam to relax the urethra, meloxicam for pain (both so it would be easier to pass small stones) and an antibiotic. This is the vet who saved her last year by using some tool to pull a stone out of the urethra that was causing blockage.

We dropped the antibiotic some months ago with no problems and then the meloxicam. She started making pain sounds a couple of weeks ago & he restarted the meloxicam. He couldn't tell from the xray if there are stones or not.

He said he kept a stone pig going for 5 years with this approach.

duskern

Post   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:39 am


Lynx wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:45 am I hope not too, though it is the most likely cause. Not rereading, but can you summarize the changes you have made to help her deal with stones?
We have not made any changes as such. Our vet told us to keep giving her cucumber 2-3 times a day to keep a solid intake of fluids that would help wash through her. Or something like that. But that's something we have been doing for some time, also before we had the stone removed. We have cut down on the amount of carrots we give them, so now it's only every other day. That's something I read somewhere, could help in regard to stones. I would like to do more, but it's hard to figure out what exactly that should be.
Bookfan wrote: Tue Oct 16, 2018 1:47 pm We have a stone-prone pig & the vet prescribed diazepam to relax the urethra, meloxicam for pain (both so it would be easier to pass small stones) and an antibiotic. This is the vet who saved her last year by using some tool to pull a stone out of the urethra that was causing blockage.

We dropped the antibiotic some months ago with no problems and then the meloxicam. She started making pain sounds a couple of weeks ago & he restarted the meloxicam. He couldn't tell from the xray if there are stones or not.

He said he kept a stone pig going for 5 years with this approach.
I haven't heard about something like this before, but it sounds really interesting! . As far as I could understand on our vet, the Danish vets are a bit lacking in knowledge regarding guinea pigs, compared to the UK at least (she told me that they were far ahead in research in this field), and probably other places as well. Not saying they are bad, they are maybe just a bit isolated in a small country. Our vet does take guinea pigs serious, which is great. We actually had a hard time finding such a vet, as most vets in Denmark are mostly focused on dogs and cats /:

I would love to try something like this!

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:23 am


Stones are difficult to treat and I don't know that anyone has the answer. I am guessing most vets do not use the protocol Bookfan's vet does and success would also depend on many things. But worth trying! Keep in mind she talked about a female guinea pig, whose urethra is larger (females can more easily pass stones). Since your guinea pig is also a female, it may help.

How much cucumber do you give per day in grams? Another method of increasing fluid is soaking hay (must be removed in an hour or two to avoid molding) and wetting greens.

duskern

Post   » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:18 am


Lynx wrote: Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:23 am Stones are difficult to treat and I don't know that anyone has the answer. I am guessing most vets do not use the protocol Bookfan's vet does and success would also depend on many things. But worth trying! Keep in mind she talked about a female guinea pig, whose urethra is larger (females can more easily pass stones). Since your guinea pig is also a female, it may help.

How much cucumber do you give per day in grams? Another method of increasing fluid is soaking hay (must be removed in an hour or two to avoid molding) and wetting greens.
I think it's worth talking to our vet about it!

We usually give them cucumber 2-3 times a day, not really how many grams that is, but I could check later. Abigail, the one who had the stone, gets 2-3 cm and the cucumbers are normally 3cm in thickness. For reference, 3cm is just a bit more than 1 inch. The other two pigs gets like half of what Abigail gets.

I've seen a lot of talk about nutrition it it has gotten me all confused. It's hard to figure out what to give, and what not to give, in order to give the girls a good diet, also now that we have a pig that is prone to stones. I've seen some talk about a low calcium diet that is good for pigs with stones, but not sure what that consists of.

Also there's the question about the pellets. I think I wrote it somewhere earlier in this thread that we give them Cavia Complete, and I'm uncertain if I should change the brand to something else, especially now that we have a pig who have had a stone. It says on the nutritional page that you should avoid multi vitamin pellets. Cavia Complete has vitamin A, D3, E and C, so I suppose that actually is a multi vitamin mix, but not really sure? :)

Could you give some examples on a suiting diet?

Also, you are all so helpful! Thx so much!

/Martin

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:21 pm


It says on the nutritional page that you should avoid multi vitamin pellets.
It is multivitamins, not pellets with added vitamins that are best avoided (I don't think I mentioned pellets as an issue). Pellets generally have the correct proportion of these vitamins. Multivitamins can risk upsetting this balance because you can give the wrong amount - and if also giving pellets, you can give too much.

From the diet page, I write:
* Most guinea pig caretakers feed pellets to help meet minimum daily requirements for vitamins, minerals, and other nutrients. Some guinea pig owners choose to instead feed a wider variety of hays and fresh food, forgoing pellets due to medical conditions like recurring bladder stones. Ideally a nutritional analysis of a non-pellet based diet will ensure there are no vitamin nor mineral deficiencies.
diet.html

The best diet info for stones I have is linked to from the stones page:
www.guinealynx.info/stones.html

Cutting back on calcium helps a great deal.

Oh, and yes, to give a gram weight for the amount of cucumber you give each serving and the number of servings per day (total gram weight).

duskern

Post   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:55 pm


I must have misread some of it. It's nice to know that we are not doing anything wrong in giving them pellets. I remember that someone mentioned earlier that our current brand (Cavia Complete) isn't the best however. I will take another look at the stones page and look at the diet you mentioned.

When you write "cutting back on calcium" is there any specific vegetable you are thinking to avoid here?

I weighed the cucumber I gave to Abigail today. It's not an exact amount she are given, but I would say that they generally weigh about 30 grams each, and we usually give them cucumber three times a day. The other two gets half of what she is having.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:59 pm


I am guessing then 100 grams total a day, more or less. This would be 14 mg for peeled and 16 mg for unpeeled (not an excessive amount).
https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/foods/show ... n=&q=&ing=

https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/foods/show ... n=&q=&ing=

You would want to lower calcium for guinea pigs prone to sludge and stones. You can see how various foods compare on this page:
https://www.guinealynx.info/chart.html

duskern

Post   » Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:03 am


Lynx wrote: Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:59 pm You would want to lower calcium for guinea pigs prone to sludge and stones. You can see how various foods compare on this page:
https://www.guinealynx.info/chart.html
Thank you for you answer Lynx. I have looked at the charts on the page you linked, and I find it hard to figure out how to use it. Like, what vegetables have acceptable values of calcium, and at the same time is good food for a guinea pig. I'm not even sure what amounts of calcium are ok, and what are not. I'm hoping to be able to put together a good diet for the girls and at the same time something that is good for Abigail.

Here's the stuff we usually feed our girls: carrots, cucumber, romaine lettuce, peppers, broccoli, beetroot, celery (a variant that's called leaf celery in Danish, check the link below for a picture :))

https://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bladselleri

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:29 am


The chart can be sorted by the Ca:P ratio (calcium:phosphorus ratio). You want mid to low range, avoiding sugary fruits.
Ca:P COLOR CODES
Midrange (Calcium to Phosophorus) represented by greens.
High range by blues.
Low range by yellows.

If javascript is enabled in your browser, you can sort the various columns in the table on this page to find foods high or low in particular vitamins or minerals. If not, see [https://www.guinealynx.info/chart_CaP.html]
Go easy on the carrots, beet root, and cucumber, Skip the romaine lettuce (use a different leafy green, like green leaf or red leaf lettuce).

Read over https://www.guinealynx.info/stones.html#prevention

duskern

Post   » Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:29 am


Lynx wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:29 am The chart can be sorted by the Ca:P ratio (calcium:phosphorus ratio). You want mid to low range, avoiding sugary fruits.
Go easy on the carrots, beet root, and cucumber, Skip the romaine lettuce (use a different leafy green, like green leaf or red leaf lettuce).

Read over https://www.guinealynx.info/stones.html#prevention
Great advice Lynx, I will check it out and see what I make of it. Just to be sure what we are doing is ok... we give carrots every other day, beet root once a week, and cucumber we give like I Wrote earlier, 3x30g for Abigail and like 3x10g for the other two. I've always heard that romaine was good for them, but I guess it's not. Does it contain too much of something?

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