Ammonia Build up?

rjespicer

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:01 pm


On their site they had said about thoroughly soaking them before putting them in the machine. I had been doing that in the sink and then doing a pre-soak wash with Arm and Hammer free and Clear detergent and then a rinse and spin with no detergent. Then dry them on low in the tumble dryer (no dryer sheets), usually a couple of times. Then take them out to air before use.

However recently rather than doing the sink soak i had put them through a pre-soak without detergent to get them good and wet and then doing another pre-soak wash with Arm and Hammer Free and Clear detergent and then a rinse and spin with no detergent and then drying. Maybe I need to go back to soaking them in the sink.

I had also tried adding white vinegar to the wash a month or too ago, which was another suggestion they had to reduce the smell, but that was right before when two of the girls started having breathing issues so I am reluctant to try that again.

They smell clean enough when they come out of the wash it just seems like either they are not wicking the pee away as well as they used to (we have only had them a couple of months so I hope that isn't the issue) or one (or more) of the girls has got in to the habit of peeing in the fleece pocket recently or as I mentioned the pee is getting under them and the smell permeating through.

Unless there is some reason why their pee smells more lately or has a higher urea content? The only change in diet I am aware of over the last week is the wife giving them the small seedless champagne grapes and also putting a bunch of watermelon in for them (most of which I removed as it was way too much) which I can see might cause them to pee more due to the high water content but cant think of a reason why it would make it smell more.

Unless the ammonia smell was a red herring and the cause is something else entirely. I did notice when my wife had been feeding them the grapes she has left the stalks on so I removed them all. I dont think they ate any but could that cause issues?

She was sneezing quite a bit originally and also coughing but now the sneezing is more of an occasional snuffle and I haven't heard her cough in the evenings. I am hoping, based on that improvement and the fact that she isn't exhibiting the noisy breathing anywhere near as much (she only did it for a little bit last night as she was settling down to sleep, that what ever was causing it was temporary like an allergy or dust or the ammonia smell and she is getting better. I probably wouldn't be worrying as much if I wasn't still weighing her everyday as her weight last night is up 2g from what it was on Friday last week so wouldn't have shown up if I was just weekly weighing.

As far as I can tell the other two girls are fine and all of them are out running around as usually and seem to be eating plenty of Pellets, Hay, veggies and Wheatgrass.

Will see how the are when i get home from work.

bpatters
And got the T-shirt

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:54 pm


You said she pees on the tarp next to the pad? Is the whole bottom of the cage not covered in an absorbent material?

Whatever you put in the cage, there shouldn't be any place for puddles to form.

rjespicer

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:07 pm


Not at present. It is the Guineadad liners (similar to the fleece liners made from U Haul Blankets) on top of a tarp and there are a couple of places where the Guineadads dont cover the tarp fully.

That will change next week with the new cage but I can put some of the small fleeces we have down in the meantime.

When we get the C&C cage set up will the Guineadad/Fleece liners be sufficient or do we need something else between them and the Coroplast?? Had been trying to get away from needing to use paper or wood bedding. They should be a perfect fit for the cage we are getting with no gaps.

rjespicer

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:17 pm


Here is a picture of the current set up.

Image

We went from a Katy Cage to a Midwest and then to the current set up to give them more space.

It uses Kaytee Hamster fences (which you can see some of in the back right of the picture below) that they can budge if the bump in to them. We can also open up to let them out to run.

Image

In the picture there is more tarp showing as we have the fence opened up for the to get out for some floor time. It is usually just a 2-3 inch strip where the bowls are. I try to position the fence around the rest of the pen so there are no gaps but since it isn't fixed then can bump it out of the way if they are determined enough.

Any pee spots are mopped up as soon as they are spotted but most of the time they do pee on GD/Fleeces.

Oddly enough although it is meant for hamsters the fence is Guinea Pig proof, but is not hamster proof they can climb over it.

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2018 10:38 pm


Just a heads up that the "tarp" you are using is probably not completely waterproof. It is a woven material with a coating that can easily fail. I have had those brown tarps and they may be part of your problem.

In the past I have used some rubber pond liner on occasion to protect surfaces (I had large scraps around). They are completely waterproof and could be cleaned. Can you just put them directly on the coroplast?

WICharlie

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:59 am


Shower curtains or plastic drop clothes (used to cover a floor when painting) can work also. It's possible that the pig just sat in the urine to have developed an ammonia smell. Or dragged through a puddle of it. It's important to have the entire surface of their area covered with something that will absorb underneath and then have a fleece top.

rjespicer

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:35 pm


The Tarp will be going when we switch to the C&C cage with the Coroplast base which arrives Monday.

Then the Liners will go on to the Coroplast base of that with no gaps, so there should be nowhere for pee puddles to form.

What seems to be happening is that they like to pee with their butt up against the fence so the pee doesnt go on the liner but onto the tarp outside the fence and then seeps back under the liners.

I usually check the tarp when I do a full clean and I havent seen any leakage so far.

Basically what we have now was put together with what ever we had when it became clear that cages, even the MidWest, were way to small.

Once we have the new cage in place it shouldn't be a problem but thatnks for the tips I will bear them in mind in future.

Siouxsie isn't making the harsh noises anymore but still sneezes occasionally but not as loudly as before although her weight did go down again slightly yesterday (611g).

I am hoping she puts some weight on today as they usually seem to eat more when I am around at the weekend than they do during the week.

rjespicer

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2018 5:46 pm


Checked on the Liners manufacturers site and they now have a message about soaking the liners in water for at least 2 hours once a month to loosen up any dried Pee so will be doing that.

The problem always seems to be in the same area which is where our biggest Girl Chunkta always settles down. It looks like she is peeing and pooping there more and the pee isnt being wicked away as well as it used to be so maybe the soaking will help otherwise I will have to see if there is a way to persuade here to pee elsewhere.

Usually the pee is soaked up pretty well and the poop can just be swept or picked up and it still does that elsewhere but where she settles the pee is making the poop mushy as it doesn't seem to be soaking up as well as it should. I had to clean poop shoes off of one of her paws this morning and also off of one of Siouxsies as well. I don't think it is that she has soft poop as others of hers elsewhere in the pen seem fine but that the pee is soaking in to them and making them soft.

Will see if the soaking helps.

rjespicer

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:58 pm


Feeling a little relieved Siouxsies weight is up from 611 to 631 today. I know that could just be water weight but after it decreasing everyday since Sunday I am grateful that her weight didnt go down again today.

Soaked the liners that I replaced today and the one that was where we were having the issue with smell and smushed poop turned the water quite dark after about an hour so soaked it again in clean water for another hour. Will do the same with the second set when I switch them.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:09 pm


The layered liners do have the advantage of being easier to handle but may be harder to clean than multiple thinner layers. It sounds like dissolved poop may be getting inside and holding the pee. Cleaning them thoroughly takes dedication.

I may have mentioned I used cotton diapers for my two kids when they were babies. In the old days, one could purchase the kind that had to be folded (thinner, so they washed more thoroughly) or a more thickly layered one that did not have to be folded. I used the thin ones which I thought washed more thoroughly and dried more quickly. Also, the newer machines use less water so it can be harder to clean thick items. The washer I used years ago, used tons of water (top loader).

rjespicer

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:32 pm


I remember my Mum soaking diapers in a bucket prior to washing them. She used the Terry Cotton ones on us back in the 60s.

Our washer is a top loader and I set the rinse level to high.

Will see if the soaking helps but that may be the issue, maybe it is too good and soaking up the pee that it takes a bit of a soak to get it to let it go again.

So far the liners have been great as far as keeping everyone dry and smooshed poop free.

Will maybe see about getting a few potty pads as well to see if that helps

rjespicer

Post   » Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:15 pm


As I have mentioned in a couple of other threads after another one of our girls , Nala, having breathing issues we have stopped them being able to use the pockets on the Guinedad Liners we have where we were getting the build up of smell.
Since stopping them from being able to sit and sleep in the pockets with their pee and poop (even though we spot clean 3-4 times a day and change them out for clean ones every 2-3 days) we have seen a noticeable improvement in Nala's breathing.
If it all works out we may cut the pockets of completely rather than turning them inside out so they are under the liner and not accessible

Just adding the info here in case it helps anyone out in future.

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