Candy - weightloss

Post Reply
User avatar
Mum
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Wed Jan 24, 2007 10:46 pm


I had a pig with a humungous stone that caused absolutely no symptoms at all - it was parked at the bottom of her urethra and was easily removed.

These stones, though are different. There are at least 15 of them, sized like a pinhead, filling her bladder.

We can only hope that they'll break off in little pieces and she'll be able to pass them.

Weaver, I store my CC in the freezer - it lasts for ages like that.

User avatar
Becky

Post   » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:05 pm


Ph values are 0-7 is acidic (low ph) and 7-14 is alkaline (high ph) with 7 being neutral. If anyone knows something different, please correct me!

Are you doing daily subcues? I'd certainly do so and keep a close eye for blockage. When their bladders start filling up with stones (and if they're that little, I'd almost call them sludge instead), they seem to produce mucus that can block them up.

Did the x-ray show the kidneys? Any stones there?

It's great that she's eating!

User avatar
rshevin

Post   » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:20 pm


Mum, I can't find any references for standard urine pH values but I do have pH paper for rough measurements. I could test my 2 boars if you'd like or I can send you some strips to test your herd (or both). We could start a table of averages around GL.

User avatar
Mum
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:38 pm


Somewhere recently, somebody posted that her vet said the ph should be 6 - but this was the first reference I'd heard for a 'normal' ph. Yes, it would be great to post your boys ph's. Or I could go out and get some ph test strips and test my other pigs (I wonder if I can use the pool strips, hmm?). Candy's ph was 9, and my vet said we should acidify this if possible. He recommended extra vitamin C to do this, but I'm pretty sure I read something contraindicating exta vitamin C with stones (wish I could pull up that resource).

Becky, I haven't started daily subcues simply for one reason: while she's drinking a LOT each day (yesterday 16 ounce), she's also on lasix for fluid in her lungs. My vet was wary about subcuing her with this fluid and lasix. My thinking was that I'd start subcues in a few days when the fluid is gone (which, of course, I'll know telepathically!. Of course I do know that subcues are always recommended for stones, but I think the fluid in her lungs is something I need to address immediately. But I could easily be wrong on this.

User avatar
Becky

Post   » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:51 pm


Ah, I forgot about the lasix.

Candy's ph was 9, and my vet said we should acidify this...

Why on earth would he want to acidify her urine?

User avatar
Mum
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:52 pm


Because he thought it was too alkaline, which was causing a base for stones to be formed?

User avatar
rshevin

Post   » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:54 pm


Because guinea pigs use minerals to make their naturally acidic urine more basic. The theory is that Candy has too many minerals (namely Ca and P) in her urine that aren't being utalized in the nuteralization process. Lowering the pH of the urine would use up the extra minerals and help get rid of the stones.

Mum, you were probably the one who told me about the contraindications of C and stones but I seem to have read it too. I thought that was what polycitra was for?

User avatar
Mum
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:01 am


I thought that was what polycitra was for?
Me too. But now I'm going to have to find all the threads!

I did get an rx for it today, and it's waiting for me at the pharmacy. But before I use it I want to be sure it'll be helpful in this particular situation.

User avatar
Becky

Post   » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:03 am


Calcium carbonate stones (the most common stones formed by guinea pigs) form in a more acidic environment. I really cannot imagine that you would want to lower the ph to "use up the extra minerals and help get rid of the stones." This makes no sense to me.

Because guinea pigs use minerals to make their naturally acidic urine more basic.

Could you offer a more detailed explanation.

Also, guinea pigs have a naturally alkaline urine.

User avatar
rshevin

Post   » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:04 am


Again, I couldn't quote you a reference, but I think polycitra is specific to the composition of stones found. Since you don't have any that Candy has passed to be analysed (or the $ to waste by having them analyzed), it might be a shot in the dark. If it works, great but if it doesn't, I don't know if there's any potential contraindications to be concerned about.

I have my boys set up right beside me for a free catch urine sample. i.e. They're both in clean carriers and I'm waiting for them to pee. It'll be good. I can test both pH and for the presence of glucose. If there's anything else I can test at home, let me know in the next few minutes!

User avatar
Becky

Post   » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:08 am


Polycitra is not specific to the composition of the stone. The only time it would not be recommended is if the stone(s) are/were struvite. Chances are, they are calcium carbonate.

Polycitra, in other animals, makes the urine more alkaline. Since guinea pig urine already is alkaline, the theory is that it introduces more citrates to the urine to bind with the calicum and carry it off in the urine.

User avatar
rshevin

Post   » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:21 am


Smudgie's pH was around 7 (hard to be exact with a color strip). Negative for urine glucose, as expected. Still waiting on Piggy to pee.

Post Reply