Timmay - choking with handfeeding

PigHerder

Post   » Mon May 21, 2007 5:06 pm


Update:

Timmay seems to be doing better today so far. He is eating more and started drinking last night. I do not know if it was coincidence, but he started eating/drinking after being put on .35cc Baytril. He is also receiving .5cc reglan q12h and .07cc metacam q24h. The reglan was prescribed when he quit eating to promote the GI tract to keep moving. Is it safe to dc this, once I am assured that he continues eating? He has been on it a few days. I figure there is no issue, but I wanted to double check.

Regarding his paralysis, when he drags himself now, his back feet frequently pull up as if to help him. It has not been quite two weeks. I take this as a very good sign and think getting him a set of wheels once he is out of quarantine will be especially helpful. He certainly looks ready to come out to play and be in a little bigger cage!

I may trim the pics later to a postable size, but for right now, here is a picture of when he first came in:
http://www.cavymeadows.org/pics/timmay/dscf4860.jpg

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snowflakey
E's Moriarity

Post   » Mon May 21, 2007 6:19 pm


Timmay is beautiful! It's okay to keep him on the motility drugs for a bit - I had a pig on them long-term (intermittently) for chronic intermittent inappetance. Keep an eye out for antibiotic intolerance, and get some acidophilus to feed him an hour or so after the baytril. I don't know if the motility drugs help keep him eating with the baytril. My pigs always get a bit off their food when on antibiotics.

He needs a little wheel chair. Have you read the "Roxy Roller" thread?

Duh, I see that you've mentioned pinta in your first post. Roxy did really well with her cart! Good luck with Timmay.

PigHerder

Post   » Mon May 21, 2007 7:00 pm


The odd thing with the baytril this time is that just after I started it, TImmay actually BEGAN eating. It could be coincidence or it could be the baytril really knocked the infection sideways and Timmay started feeling well enough to eat.

Yes, he gets benebac 2 hours after baytril, 50mg of vitamin C and simethicone prn.

I am still perfecting his harness, but life (and feeding him every 4 hours) has kept me away from finishing the project. It's fairly moot until he gets out of isolation later this week.

Currently Timmay does not eat much when food is placed in his cage, but only when out on my desk when I actively flaunt it in front of him. It is still a whole lot easier than handfeeding him.

PigHerder

Post   » Thu May 24, 2007 6:18 pm


Timmay had that brief period where he was eating and drinking normally. He still continues to drink, but he rarely eats.

We saw the vet yesterday and he was given an injection of Buprenex, to see if it was pain that was keeping him from eating. He woud not eat that evening, but during the night he ate a little. Unfortunately, he lost 2 ounces yesterday. He will not eat this morning.

The other theory is that his GI tract just feels lousy/doesn't feel it much because of the hind end paralysis. I will start him on cisapride soon (he's been on reglan, but that's more for upper GI), but wanted to give a chance to see if the Buprenex helped.

If it is because of the paralysis, this guy may need handfeeding for two months before recovering enough function. It is interesting to note that he was eating when he came in (a couple days after the accident) and slowly stopped.

99% of the time, he ignores the food in his cage - frequently he lies on top of it. He does eat some amount of hay. His teeth have been visually checked by an experienced cavy vet and pronounced more perfect than most.

Every once in awhile, the boy of the house is able to "trick" him into nibbling a little lettuce by playing with it. I have tried this trick, but it doesn't seem to work so well for me. Then again, I'm the one always shoving a syringe into his mouth.

I am not sure what to do here. With surgery coming up next week and moving in June, I'm not going to be able to take care of this guy to this extent, this long term.

I would welcome any suggestions folks have as to how to get him eating better or what I might do next week when it will not be possible for me to take care of him. There aren't any shelters here that would do this level of care and affording boarding at a vet is not an option. I am currently casting about for volunteers, but of course it is an enormous task to ask a person to take on. When I took him, I did not know about the surgery or about the moving.

edit: I discontinued the Baytril when he quit eating, but it has not made an impact.

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Barbara Osborn
Supporter from '05 - '12

Post   » Thu May 24, 2007 6:40 pm


Ah, poor little guy.

Pigherder, I hope your surgery goes well and that you can enjoy your rest and cure.

Anyone here at GL live in Portland , Oregon area who can help her out?

PigHerder

Post   » Fri May 25, 2007 1:36 am


Thanks Barbara. It seems I have some amazing friends who will try to make it to my location to help take care of the pigs (and heat up my soup) next week.

If both of my friends make it up here, they claim they can handle it, which solves the immediate problem. What I'm going to do when I am in Seattle hunting for an apartment for two weeks and then moving, I am not sure.

BTW, I do have a potential adopter lined up for this guy - I just have to get him healthy enough to go home. :)

PigHerder

Post   » Tue Jun 05, 2007 3:42 pm


This is driving me crazy. Timmay continues to not eat or drink enough to support him, but the cause is very unclear. It almost looks psychological. I know the good folks here sometimes come up with very innovative ideas, so I thought people might have some good suggestions. I have not had bloodwork done for him yet, but I am not convinced anything would show up. If it's a gut or behavioural issue, it wouldn't. He looked to be in good condition when I got him, besides the obvious trauma from the fall.

Timmay will not eat when food is put in his cage, or if he does, it's tiny nibbles. He will not drink in his C&C cage (next to a neighbor, but they get along fine). It doesn't matter what bottle is placed on the cage or where. If he does drink from it, it's just a sip or two and he stops.

He does more drinking when placed in the 30x30" cage with the narrow-mouthed bottle. Again, I've put this bottle on the C&C cage to no avail.

He also does some drinking if you HOLD the water bottle, angling it so the spout is horizontal, then tipping up as he gets more enthusiastic. He is perfectly perky when he starts drinking, it's not that he's too lethargic to drink. I have tried rigging up an angle on the C&C cage, no luck.

Food is similar. He'll sit and eat lettuce, provided I am right there, preferably playing with the lettuce if he stops eating. He could hungrily eat a whole leaf of lettuce, but if had put that same lettuce right in front of his nose in the cage, he wouldn't touch it. Only on my lap.

His paralysis has improved dramatically, but his eating/drinking pattern has not changed, which you'd think there would be if it were related to the paralysis as hypothesized. Come to think of it, he does eat a little bit more while on my lap. Last visit he was given a strong pain killer to see if the pain was keeping him from eating, but aside from some nibbles during the night, he did not eat.

I've wondered if some of this behaviour is related to being a classroom pig with children never leaving him alone (and taking him home on weekends), but he just has to eat on his own sometime. Not only is he not adoptable this way, but it's making it incredibly difficult to move/apartment shop to another state.

I am still handfeeding him and would like to hear schedules that other people follow with handfeeding. Typically I do every four hours, but I found this guy tolerates 6 hours, so I would sleep for 6 hours, then do every four hour feedings after that. When I inquired at the exotics vet about boarding, they said "we get enough food into them during the day, that it's not a problem to go the 13 hours at night." That sounded weird to me... their little guts always need food going through it. I am however going to give every 8 hours a go... he seems perfectly perky, long as I make sure he stays hydrated. 8 hours would be far more manageable if it comes to taking him to Seattle with us to apartment shop.

help! Is there anything else I can try to get him to eat/drink on his own?

maremma

Post   » Tue Jun 05, 2007 8:45 pm


Aww the poor little guy! I am so sorry he isn't eating and drinking on his own.

Is he still on the reglan? Did he start the cisapride?

Has the vet given him metacam or steroids? One of the vets my babies go to put Joey on metacam last year when he began losing weight and we couldn't find a reason why. He said the idea was that it tends to stimulate the appetite as well as relieve pain. It worked. Joey began eating normally and regianed his lost weight in a few days.

Perhaps the nerves that signal hunger are still healing or inflammed. If they are inflammed a steroid may well help.

PigHerder

Post   » Tue Jun 05, 2007 8:52 pm


The reglan and cisapride have been discontinued. They didn't seem to help and there has been no change without it.

He was initially on metacam for the first two weeks (during which he stopped eating), with no improvement.

He was given a painkiller (mentioned in an earlier post), with no real improvement. Steroids I believe were given just before he was handed over, but not since.

How much metacam was Joey put on and his weight?

Did Joey exhibit similar symptoms as far as eating only with attention?

maremma

Post   » Wed Jun 06, 2007 5:19 am


Joey was only eating minimal amounts of pellets and hay on his own but yes he would eat if I held him and coaxed him.

He was 2pounds 4 ounces and had dropped to 2 pounds before I could get it under control.

He was given metacam .05mls every 12 hours.

To be honest I think at that time he was emotionally depressed and that is what caused the problem. Joey is my most interactive and emotional baby. There were some changes in the guinea room right before he stopped eating.

It seems like your boy may also be depressed. The poor little guy probably can't understand why when he tries to run and walk his legs don't do what they are suppose to.

It may take him several months to completely readjust to his disability. Do you have a really gentle baby that you could try putting in with him at least some of the time? Having LilBilly with Joey did a world of good for both of them.

PigHerder

Post   » Thu Jun 07, 2007 5:22 pm


Timmay has been placed with Benjamin and is currently drinking, but still requires lap time to eat his lettuce and is still being supplemented with CC. I still need a sitter for him between June 14th-17th. I may have to pay the $$$ to board him at the vet's, although I am not sure at all that they do Sundays.

At least I don't have to needle stick the poor guy now, and he has done great at getting his mobility back.

He is still doing towel/cardboard/hair chewing behaviour, I am going to put him back on reglan for a couple days and see if it makes any difference.

chii
I Love Lucy

Post   » Thu Jun 07, 2007 5:32 pm


Hey PH-- Just wanted to let you know I haven't forgotten you! I started a reply to your email, will finish today. I've been working my stupid 12+ hour shifts and (big surprise) ended up sick and zonked out on cold meds for a good portion of the last day.

Hugs to Timmay...

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