Post   » Wed May 16, 2007 1:32 am

Moody is doing well. His weight has stabilized. He no longer appears symptomatic. Unfortunately, we could not afford another set of x-rays at this time to check the actual visual results.

The vet did double check and confirm the Benadryl dosage (although we never needed to use it)at 9mg.

Moody is on lasix .08cc and enalapril 2.5mg both twice daily.

I have found you all very helpful, and it has enabled me to ask the right questions. I am comfortable with the care and therapy for Moody. I am not a vet or a medical person, so my understanding is based solely on this discussion and the one with my vet. Both have been helpful.

You can quote me

Post   » Wed May 16, 2007 5:01 pm

Very good to hear he's doing well.

Lynx, thanks for the pericardial correction. That's an important distinction and clarification to make, for this thread and for other readers down the road.

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Post   » Wed May 16, 2007 8:02 pm

It's just something I ran across when I was doing the heart page. There may be other conditions and terms. I did the best I could with the material I had (tried to only explain things that made sense to me).

Little Jo Wheek

Post   » Wed May 16, 2007 11:43 pm

I don't know. I think it must be a combination of things--older vets do seem to use the Lasix first since they are not as familiar with the ACE inhibitors or Ca-channel blockers that are today's heart meds. None of the older heart drugs were nearly as safe, and thus, would probably kill a pig.

I think the younger vets are more savvy to the newer drugs and prescribe those first over Lasix if the animal isn't in severe trouble (has excess fluid). If the pig has excess fluid, then Lasix is also indicated.

Get on your bike.

Post   » Wed May 16, 2007 11:57 pm

Thanks Jo.

Little Jo Wheek

Post   » Thu May 17, 2007 12:02 am

No prob. Thanks for the heads-up. I mostly avoid this forum when I can since reading the threads usually leads to yelling and screaming (on my part) and mixing up whatever I can find in the liquor cabinet to quell my headaches.

You can quote me

Post   » Thu May 17, 2007 10:30 pm

I hear you, part II ;-)


Post   » Sat Jun 09, 2007 6:16 pm


Moody's condition appears to have stabilized. We have noted excess nose wheezing when timothy hay is put in his cage and when he eats tomatoes. So, we are "on to" those.

We replaced his bedding with fleece, which appears to help.

He is putting on weight, but still has some slight nose wheezing. The heart meds seem to be helping, however.

Hopefully, we will have some baseline x-rays done soon - the old ones were not post medication.

Thanks for the advice.


Post   » Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:58 am

I am glad to hear Moody is beginning to stablize.

Your baby sounds a lot like my Max. He has nasal symptoms along with his heart condition. There are some things you can do to aid him there as well.

I made Max a nebulizer unit. He gets mucomyst .01 mls in with sterile saline solution up to the fill line on the cup. He goes in there 2 times day for 7 days when his sinuses are giving him hard time. The nebulizer stays running for 20 minutes then I shut it off and let him in there an additional 10 minutes. This works amazingly well to get the excess mucus thin enough for him to sneeze it out and breath easier.

It may be scary at first because they will sound worse when you first get them out of the container. (unless he already sneezed it all out while in there) It is because the mucous has thinned though so it makes more noise than the more dangerous thick stuff it was to begin with. It gets less and less with each treatment until they are breathing quite clear.

I must refind an article I discovered while doing research on heart issues. I thought I saved it to favorites but now it isn't in there?

Accourding to what I read the nasal fluid/mucous is related to the heart condition just liek fluid building in the lungs around the heart, feet etc.


Post   » Sun Jul 08, 2007 2:15 am

I am curious how you made the nebulizer unit. Moody still has a lot of trouble -particularly when given timothy hay. Most other times he is fairy controlled. I hesitate to take him off hay because of its other benefits.

Does anyone else have experience with a pig getting "hay fever?"

Let Sleeping Pigs Lie

Post   » Sun Jul 08, 2007 2:43 am

These may help:

A link to Purrie's nebulizer-building page.

A link to Paravati's nebulizer.

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Post   » Sun Jul 08, 2007 2:44 am

Wait, it's just when he gets timothy? Have you tried orchard grass, bluegrass, brome, oat, etc? He'd still have to have some timothy in his pellets but you could drastically reduce the timothy dust by switching varieties of dry hay. There would be no ill effects to this. Orchard and bluegrass are the 2 most common. Both are known to significantly reduce allergies in most pig slaves.


Post   » Sun Jul 08, 2007 7:07 pm

Tracis, thanks for the nebulizer site.

Rshevin, it seems to be a problem with timothy hay. I haven't tried any others as of yet (it seems to be the only one available locally. I will see though what I can do to find other hays.

He is doing pretty well on the heart meds until I stick that hay near his cage. Cleaning his cage frequently (like every other day - I now use fleece and towels) helps keep allergy symptoms at bay, but.....

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I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2007 7:57 pm

He is doing pretty well on the heart meds
But he's not on heart meds yet, is he?

In your email you said he was just on lasix.

The fact that he has an enlarged heart and fluid indicates he needs to be put on ACE inhibitors - for instance Lotensin.

He will not get better on lasix, and no matter what meds he's on his heart will remain enlarged.

Lotensin will, with any luck, enable you to reduce or entirely cut out the lasix - which is a good thing. And he should stay much more stable.

You can quote me

Post   » Fri Aug 10, 2007 9:46 pm

Lasix is a diuretic, not a heart med per se. It will continue to help his symptoms, but will not address the underlying condition causing those symptoms.

We have one that has both a heart problem and an asthmatic or COPD-like disorder (it appears, anyway; the vets are stumped). She gets Lotensin daily; the least-dusty hay we can give her, and we take a lot of care to minimize dust and dusty stuff around her cage.

In real hot or real cold weather, the room is kept pretty much closed up and this doesn't help. Sometimes she'll start softly hooting and when she does, if at all possible we open the windows and thoroughly air the room. Usually this stops her hooting.

On occasion she'll breathe noticeably and extremely heavily. Then we give her a dose or two of Lasix. This clears the fluid, which is very important, but it doesn't address the underlying heart or pulmonary conditions.


Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:32 am

Moody is on enalaphril too. .25 cc Sorry if I wasn't clear. I emailed you all his heart meds and amounts, Mum. He is currently taking .55 cc Baytril.

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I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Sat Aug 11, 2007 10:20 am

Ah sorry - I missed that he was on enalapril!

I'm not familiar with the dosing of this drug. If you can I'd get him switched to lotensin - it's a newer generation of ACE inhibitor and gentler on the kidneys.

Once I have my pigs on a max dose of lotensin, if they hoot then I give them lasix - and up the amount as needed.

If you're still seeing fluid in the lungs it's possible that the ACE inhibitor dosage needs adjusting upwards. However, I've had a couple of pigs that have had to be on lotensin for a year or two before the lasix was able to be cut out.

I can't help with the baytril dosage, because the amount in ccs doesn't tell how many mgs he's getting.


Post   » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:51 pm

Well, it has been a tough week. Moody started to go down fast, then inexplicably he made a turn around on Thursday. His wheeze has almost disappeared, but he is very thin. Any suggestions on how to fatten him up quickly?

Mum, thanks for all of your advice and help. I am not sure if it was a URI or heart problem, all I know is he is finally breathing easy. Now to get this piggy eating again....

FYI, Moody must have licked me a hundred times Friday morning. I think he realized that I have been trying to help him.

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Post   » Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:39 am

My Oreo is on 0.625 of enalapril (a 2.5mg tab quartered) daily. He gets lasix as needed.

He is also miserably skinny, but he does well with Critical care / Pellet mush twice a day. He is under 1 kilo (knock on wood) but has been holding there, give or take an ounce for a few months now.

Unfortunately there are not really high calorie supplements for pigs like there are for humans.

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For the love of my girls!

Post   » Sun Aug 19, 2007 5:20 am

I use to feed my heart pig rolled oats to fatten her up when she was running thin. Problem is, the others all wanted them too! Not a good thing to feed all the time, but it will put some weight on them.

Tubbit was on enalapril also and I just used the Lasix as needed. She really didn't need it that often as long as I didn't forget the Enalapril. She had many happy years thanks to all the help here and those two drugs!

I still miss her.

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