Request for heart pig stories

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sun Aug 29, 2010 1:58 pm


Thanks for the update. It's always helpful to know how guinea pigs on heart meds are responding.

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calicavylover

Post   » Sun Aug 29, 2010 8:05 pm


Your welcome Lynx. I should add that with the enlapril there was no difference at all in her activity, energy or really anything. In fact her hooting continued to get worse. Although here eyes were not runny they were very crusty all of the time. She was lethargic and really struggled to breathe.
She also experienced tooth issues during that time. One of her incisors was infected at the root and she also had spurs on her molars. It seems like this combo of meds is the right choice for her. It did take about 3 weeks on this combo for me to see a real difference. We suspect that her heart murmur is the reason for the need for the vetmedin.

pinta

Post   » Mon Aug 30, 2010 4:43 am


Tooth issues can occur in heart pigs due to the choice between breathing and eating. If they are too exhausted to eat(due to a weak heart), the molars overgrow. The molars need constant grinding action to keep from overgrowing

CavyHeart

Post   » Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:51 pm


1) Description: Peeve, black-and-white dalmatian American, approximately 4 years old at time of death, intact boar.

2) Symptoms: This is in hindsight, but if I had known then what I know now, I would have insisted that heart medications be tried. Peeve's primary symptoms were respiratory distress and labored breathing that never entirely resolved despite repeated courses of antibiotics, including sulfa and Baytril. It started at a fairly young age, perhaps a year old, and seemed to wax and wane. It was loud, sonorous breathing, mainly on inhalation, worse with exertion, and gradually more constant and severe with age. At first allergies to the bedding were thought to be a factor, and for the later half of his life he lived on fleece and/or Carefresh. This did help slightly but never completely alleviated his troubles. He became less energetic as he got older, even though 4 is not really all that old, only able to run a lap or two during floor time before he was too worn out to do more than walk.

3) Diagnostics: Numerous vet exams, x-rays, phone consultations with 3 different veterinarians. I did not have an autopsy done, though perhaps I should have.

4) Treatment: Antibiotics, bedding changes, antihistamines, oral antifungal medications.

5) Results: At first, multiple courses of antibiotics were tried on the theory that it was recurrent URI despite his cage-mate never having so much as a sniffle and no exposure to drafts, extreme temperatures, and so forth. After unrevealing x-rays at about 3 years of age, I even tried children's liquid Benadryl (dose calculated by the vet) in case it was a chronic allergy, but this had little effect and so was stopped to avoid making him unnecessarily drowsy. Shortly before he died, he developed a significant fungal infection in the genital area and was placed on an oral antifungal. However, he stopped eating, and since loss of appetite can be a side effect of those medications, he was switched to a different oral antifungal medication. After only a day and a half of this medication, he suddenly went into severe failure and died in my arms while I was on the phone trying to get an earlier veterinary appointment than the one I had already scheduled that day.

6) Other medical problems: Peeve had no other known medical problems other than a brief and mild case of the mites that all piggies seem to deal with, easily treated with Ivermectin. No pea eye.

liland

Post   » Tue Sep 28, 2010 1:52 pm


1 - Tesla, Swiss breed, 5 months old at first sypmtoms, male.

2 - Hooting every other day, wheezing every other day, inactivity, grumpy behavior, not eating much hay, drinking approx. 100-200ml water each day.

3 - Vet listened to heart and performed ultrasound scan, diagnosed vegetative endocarditis (infection of the heart valves, little bits breaking off and travelling into lungs, resulting in a hooting and wheezing episode), likely resulting from an infection when newly born, which was left untreated.

4 - Initially started on Baytril (0.4ml daily) and Metcam (0.3ml daily). Now on pediatric septrin (0.4ml twice daily) and Metacam (0.3ml daily). Also taking Avipro probiotic daily. To be scanned again after 2 months of treatment.

5 - Metacam was started before Baytril, resulted in immediate perk up of Tesla, eating more, playing more, less grumpy. No improvement (in terms of wheezing and hooting episodes) after 3 weeks of Baytril, so have switched to Septrin.

6 - Not taking heart meds, as the heart is not currently enlarged, and is not under extra pressure or experiencing a murmur. May be necessary in the future depending on his progress.

pinta

Post   » Tue Sep 28, 2010 8:03 pm


I would start the heart meds now. You'll know if he improves then it's the right course of treatment.

liland

Post   » Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:11 am


The vets I've been to both (I got a second opinion from a piggy expert) say he doesnt need it, and wont give it to me.

pinta

Post   » Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:30 am


No improvement (in terms of wheezing and hooting episodes) after 3 weeks of Baytril

Sigh. This is always how it starts. I had a pig diagnosed with Walking Pneumonia by a top radiologist. She was always on ABs. All the lung sounds disappeared when we put her on heart meds on a hunch. Her Pea Eye also disappeared with the lasix. She was one of our earlier heart pigs. With her we made the connection between Pea Eye and excess fluid in the lungs.

For many heart pigs there is no clue except for observational signs...unless you cut them open, section the heart and send it to a lab.....

Hopefully your vet will read this thread to get a feel for how many pigs have improved on heart meds because owners and vets were willing to try a course of heart meds.

liland

Post   » Wed Sep 29, 2010 7:54 am


To be clear, Tesla doesnt have any fluid in the lungs, his heart is normal size and his pulse is normal too. For this reason both of the vets deduced that his heart wasnt under any abnormal pressure, and he also has no murmur.

pinta

Post   » Wed Sep 29, 2010 3:06 pm


yup. I know. If it was that easy to diagnose heart issues in pigs it wouldn't be such a fight to get them on heart meds. Lucky are the owners who are blessed with clinical signs. By the way - pigs can fake a good pulse at the vets. Prey animals have that skill. But they can't keep it up forever. My vet has often discovered a racing heart rate at the end of the appointment when at the beginning it was a prfect heart rate.

The fact is your pig is still hooting and wheezing. If he has a bacterial infection and the baytril isn't the appropriate AB, then after 3 weeks he should be very very ill. Pigs die from untreated URIs. If the AB isn't working essentially the "URI is untreated". But he isn't any sicker......At this point vets will go for the allergy diagnosis or asthma. Yet no matter what they do the hooting and wheezing don't go away.

Yes, it might not be heart issues but a simple course of heart meds will rule heart issues out or confirm them at very little risk to the pig. The other option is keep trying AB after AB (probably the same degree of risk to the pig as heart meds) until the vet decides it must be asthma or allergies.

liland

Post   » Wed Sep 29, 2010 4:08 pm


Tesla doesnt have a URI, the infection is in his heart only.

I didnt know that about heart rates - I cant work out the need for it in the wild, being as no-one in the wild would be listening to their pulse?

Today we had one very minor episode, only about ten mintues long of hooting and no wheezing, and after he did twenty minutes of zoomies! I'm on the lookout for the next episode though.

pinta

Post   » Thu Sep 30, 2010 2:32 am


I'm gonna guess that and untreated infection in the heart would severely compromise the pig.....

It's nothing to do with listening to pulses in the wild. A sick animal in a herd gets picked off by predators therefore it is in the best interest of a herd (prey)animal to appear as healthy as possible. They have the ability to "fake health" in times of stress - for awhile. But they can't do it forever.

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