I get you point about the palpation, and will make sure it never happens again. You trust the person as the expert, which I know she is, but I'll be better prepared in future.
I'm seeing the rodentologist later today, so will go with a list of questions and see what she says.
I'm still trying to get Maggige to part with some poop, but she just won't do it to order, and Boy, has she got a strong will. I'll discuss that this afternoon and maybe the rodentologist will have a pig who can help, otherwise, I'll be asking for donations!
Noddy is still hanging in there, and his weight is the same as yesterday, which is good. However, his poops have become a bit softer again, though still formed, and quite smelly. Do you think there could be an underlying malignancy? Or is his weight loss to slow for that?
She's going to try some topical anti-fungals, which stupidly, I hadn't tried, although he has had systemic anti-fungals.
In view of the aerococcus, she's going to put him on Septrin, to see if that helps. She knows of a vet locally who can do X-rays without anaesthetic, so if there's no improvement, or even if there is, I can pursue that route.
The only other thing she's wondering, is whether Noddy's kidneys are failing, given his age. I had wondered that myself, as he's drinking more. She's going to test his urine, although a recent test showed no abnormality and I would have expected there to be protein in his urine if his kidneys were failing. However, it would account for the sudden, unexplained weight loss.
She's kept both Noddy and MaggieMae in, to observe them, so I'm pig-less and don't know what to do with myself. If anyone has any pigs they need a holiday home for, for a few days, you know where to come!
I feel better now someone is at least trying to get to the bottom of the problem, rather than just writing him off as an "old "pig, as the vets have. As soon as I have any more news, I'll update you.
That made me laugh about the poop soup and donations hahah :) My male that donated was at the vet and when he bent down to get a caecal, they took it from his mouth HAHA.
And only in my opinion, I wouldn't rule out a tumor. I've had way too much experience with those :( And unfortunately it seems as though every pig is different and it depends on where the tumor is and if they're in pain or not. Have you noticed Noddy in pain? A good sign is grinding their teeth. I hope it's not a tumor, but just throwing it out there since you were thinking about it.
And Noddy isn't *that* old :) And I just thought of something else too since you mentioned kidneys. My Custard was tested for a UTI but my vet found glucose in her urine. The test for diabetes was negative so that led my vet to her having a kidney infection. Hoping for an infection rather than them failing (both not good, but hoping for the best of the worst!). Custard is on Septrin for 6 weeks and seems to be doing very well.
Sending good vibes! I know it sucks to be pigless! I wouldn't know what to do with myself! Sending good vibes :) You're a great parent and luckily have a very caring vet :)
I've still got a nasty feeling about tumour, and although an X-ray won't be definitive, it might help to rule certain things out. The only time Noddy has been teeth grinding has been when he had bloat. There hasn't been any recently, which at least reassures me that he's probably not in pain.
You and I know that Noddy isn't "that " old, but unfortunately, most of the vets round here seem to feel that once a pig hits 5, that's it, but I'm not giving up on him yet. And he's got a new "wifepig" in MaggieMae to look after.
Thanks again for all your really useful advice and info.
She doesn't feel he's ready to give up just yet, and is keeping him a bit longer to re-hydrate him and to give the Septrin. (I could give that, but the law means she isn't allowed to give it to me to take home!) She's hoping once we get on top of his hydration, he will fel a bit better and maybe start eating more
It's not the news I was hoping for, but at least I now know he's not in pain, and I can at least support him with syringe feeding for as long as it's necessary.
Ketones can be present for lots of reasons, but the commonest are diabetes and starvation / dieting.
My understanding, for what it's worth, is that they appear when the body is using up fat instead of carbohydrate for energy, so Lynx, you are absolutely right in what you say. Also, if you aren't getting sufficient fluid, either from not drinking enough, or losing it from "leaky " kidneys, you burn fat in order to get fluid, with the same result as dieting - ketones and weight loss. If I've got that round my neck, please correct me!
Noddy had been eating much less than usual,which would also account for the ketones. So I think either way he would have ketones in his urine.
I'm hoping that if the rodentologist can get him re-hydrated, he might start to feel a bit better and start eating again, but I fear that he will never get back to the nearly 1600g bruiser that he was. Just to get him home agin would be good, because the house is still very empty without him and MaggieMae.
- You can quote me
My understanding of ketones is essentially the same as HH's -- with the exception of substituting "protein" (i.e., muscle tissue) where HH has written "fat". There are (ditto) different kinds as I understand it that can appear for different reasons, but the body's consuming its own muscle tissue (for lack of anything else to consume) is the main one. As I understand it. I am no MD (or nurse or tech or anything else).
The update is basically that she has found Noddy not only has "leaky" kidneys, but his liver is failing also, which Vedra had queried when I initially saw her, and she felt he was very anaemic. He's got loads of urobilinogen in his urine, My recollection of the physiology of the liver has never been good, but as far as I remember, this is a strong indicator of liver failure, although there are other causes, such as increased breakdown of red blood cells.
If anyone can put me right, I would be very grateful.
Lou's (the rodentologist) husband is a doctor, and he apparently said if Noddy was one of his patients, he'd be in ITU waiting for a transplant. This clearly isn't an option for Noddy.
However, Lou thinks he isn't in pain, he's taking syringe feeding OK, is better hydrated, and she feels he will eventually just drift off. I really hope this is the case.
In the meantime, he'll get as much supportive care and love as I can possibly give him.
If anyone has any suggestions as to how I can continue giving him the best life possible, I would be very grateful.
- You can quote me
You might want to ask Lou (or Vedra) about herbal support for the liver. I know some GL members have tried milk thistle, with varying degrees (some good) of success.
MaggieMae has clearly taken advantage of Noddy being ill and is now incredibly cheeky, won't sit still and is sneaking food off my lap before I'm ready to give it to her. More fool me for leaving it with in reach! She just sneaks round while I'm distracted and pinches it! She certainly is a little minx! Hopefully Noddy will soon be feeling sufficiently better to get her under control again!