URGENT-CA-PHS Shelter (Bay Area)

Maineland

Post   » Sun Aug 25, 2002 10:32 pm


Oops sorry about that hh post. Hit the keys on accident and sent it before I realized what I had done.

First, Teresa (if I may so bold as to call you that since we do not know each other) may I ask if my comments upset or offended you in any way? If so, I apologize. I read and re-read my post to make sure that I did not come across as someone "trying to stir up trouble or condemn your practices."

I stated in my earlier post "She merely wants you as other rescuers(I am assuming some of you are) and pet owners to follow her lead in your care of cavies. Focus your devotion to your cavies and not to her. " I think from your reply that I was correct in my assumption.

As far as the cavalier idea.......meaning gallant, spirited brave, splendidly stated.
I think it would be a good idea for both breeder and pet stores to provide a "Care Fact" sheet for new owners. If breeders were to think about this for a minute or two they probably would see the advantage to this for both themselves and the new owner. Now to say who should decide or what should be on that sheet would probably cause another 10 page thread.

KarasKavies you are just as nasty and rude as Nastybreeder. Would you please tell me when or where in my earlier post was I mean to Teresa? When did I say she had done ANYTHING wrong? Teresa, would you please address this issue? I merely was comparing my rescue practices with yours and making observations of the differences. Did I ever condemn you for anything? Did I or did I not APPLAUDE you for your efforts, the time and money you spend? Did I not express my support for your effort to get legislation passed requiring the fact sheets?

I NEVER EVER condemned anyone for the high esteem in which they hold Teresa. I said that "SHE might find those comments embarrassing." AND IF YOU WILL READ HER REPLY MS. EVIL KARA YOU WILL FIND THAT SHE AGREED!!!!!!" Why would you want to continue to do something to a FRIEND if you KNOW that it bothers them?

Some friend you are!

Teresa, again I apologize if anything I said upset your or hurt your feelings. I assure you that it was never my intention. I found your site to be full of knowledge in regards to cavies. I am positive that it is a great source of info to many.

However, I refuse to sit idly by and be attacked for no reason other than expressing an observation by some hothead like Kara. So KARA PLEASE READ THIS: IT WOULD MAKE ME VERY HAPPY IF YOU WOULD ******SPEND YOUR TIME ELSEWHERE**********

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Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Sun Aug 25, 2002 10:52 pm


Gee, don´t pick on Kara now! This whole thread has been very upsetting to many people. I think some of Kara´s comments were not aimed at you at all. If you read all of the posts Kara has made on this board, you´d find she is a fairly even handed, friendly person. This thread has just hit a sore spot -- and sometimes people can misinterpret things (I don´t think you were being antagonistic). Seems like Teresa has had to do alot of defending of her philosophy etc. lately and Kara was afraid she was being picked on further.

I think if you stick around you´ll find Kara is a pretty nice person. I would miss her if she spent her time elsewhere.

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Teresa

Post   » Sun Aug 25, 2002 11:08 pm


Maineland, you didn´t hurt my feelings or upset me. I don´t want to speak for Kara, but she is quite far from evil and definitely doesn´t deserve to be compared to nastybreeder. She is in fact a very good friend. I think as a new poster on a forum it´s more traditional to wait until you have some history posting before you ask a long-time member to post elsewhere. Can we please not make this personal? I think that´s Kara´s point anyway, not making it personal. And she wasn´t just addressing your post. And there are others reading that she is speaking to as well. It might help to understand that this isn´t the first time both me and my rescue policies have been criticized and questioned.

We sure have different intrepretations of the word cavalier. I always associate it with the "haugthy, disdainful, supercilious, indifferent, offhand, uncaring" meaning.

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bats

Post   » Sun Aug 25, 2002 11:33 pm


Oh dear.

Maineland, you just got the award for going from a very-well-composed-and-well-thought-out posting to a harsh-and-angry post in the least amount of time. <chuckle> I usually like that in a person, particularly when the anger is well-deserved. But this time it was for naught. I believe Kara was responding to NastyBreeder and Jachqui, not you.

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KarasKavies
For the love of my girls!

Post   » Mon Aug 26, 2002 12:03 am


Maineland... did I use your name? I was addressing the entire thread. Have you read the entire thread?

Lynx... may I change my Hint of Lime name to either "Ms Evil Kara" or "Hothead Kara" You choose!

Nah, actually, neither fit...
Last edited by KarasKavies on Mon Aug 26, 2002 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

Maineland

Post   » Mon Aug 26, 2002 7:36 am


My apologies Kara if your comments were not directed specifically towards my post. The thing that ticked me off was that I felt I was being lumped into some catagory with NastyBreeder.

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Becky

Post   » Mon Aug 26, 2002 10:04 am


I´ve always heard that having a written conversation with several people at one time can lead to confusion, and, Maineland, that seems to be what has happened to you.

It is difficult to know who is speaking to whom on a forum. The best approach, in my opinion, is to take a breath, reread what is being said, and give each writer the benefit of the doubt.

I´m one of those many people who have been following this post, but staying silent, although I have become very emotionally involved. I´m called to post now because, as KK said, I also defend my friends. Kara did not deserve your comments. I´ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you just misunderstood. If that is not the case, however, understand that Kara has many friends here.

pigpal

Post   » Tue Aug 27, 2002 2:26 am


I was under the impression that it was generally accepted that a poster´s reply was directed to the whole audience unless addressed specifically to a single poster by name. There are apparently quite a few posters who leap to take personal offence when none was intended.

Thus, I might write:

Kleenmama, concerning your misquote of my earlier post - I actually wrote:

Unfortunately, far too many Christians have interpreted this "word of God" to mean they can exploit animals as they wish, regardless of how they are treated.

The key word here is "interpreted". One of my main problems with organized religion (and you are right, this is not at all limited to the Christian faith) is that followers can interpret scriptures however they wish, to suit their own agenda. For example: to treat animals as commodities, discriminate against homosexuals or bar women from receiving equal status in society.

At no point did I write that mistreating animals is a tenet of the Christian faith. However, I have met many Christians who, in discussions concerning vegetarianism and the humane treatment of animals, have categorically cited the scriptures as evidence that animals were placed on Earth for humans to use. SOME Christians, "far too many" in my opinion, interpret this to mean animals are inferior and are not entitled to be treated with the respect due to sentient creatures. You may not regard these people as true Christians, but I can assure you that is exactly what they consider themselves.

To everyone: I apologize for any confusion over my posting using Pinta´s account. It was somewhat inconvenient to spend three weeks away from home delivering rescue guinea pigs. This was one of the more minor inconveniences of these past three weeks.

As for Teresa being a saint. Far from it. Yes, she works very hard to make life better for the guinea pigs that find their way into her rescue, and also for those she will never meet. Sometimes the frustrations and exhaustion show, in her rather blunt manner in dealing with those who complain and criticize her approach.

Due to a background in computers, a large part of Teresa´s efforts use this medium to bring guinea pig care issues to the attention of the general public. This has been hugely successful, but has also brought a downside - criticism from those who see it as seeking attention and acclaim, as well as those who don´t care for the message contained. To those who seek to criticize, I suggest they spend large amounts of their own time and money creating and publicizing websites to promote their particular messages, rather than knocking someone else´s.
Last edited by pigpal on Tue Aug 27, 2002 2:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

kleenmama
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Tue Aug 27, 2002 10:46 am


And Pigpal, MY problem with your post was that as soon as a "higher power" was brought into the discussion, you swung the critisism at Christians. I was merely pointing out that it is not only Christians that misinterpret, as you have now clarified. Thank you.

pinta

Post   » Tue Aug 27, 2002 3:25 pm


How do you figure she was swinging the criticism at Christians and not Muslims?.....Christians do not have the monopoly on a "higher power" and to assume that any comment re higher power must be referring to Christians does not take into account that billions of people who believe in a higher power are NOT Christians.

pigpal

Post   » Tue Aug 27, 2002 4:17 pm


Wait a minute! There were two parts to my original post...

1. Criticizing the concept of leaving the responsibility for the ultimate outcome of medically treating/not treating to a "higher BEING". Note: not "higher power".

A higher "being" usually refers to God, Allah or some such entity. A higher "power" encompasses the forces of nature or laws of science. A totally different kettle of fish which I accept we are sometimes unable to control, lthough we certainly can influence them greatly.

2. Criticism of SOME Christians, "far too many" who interpret the scriptures giving men dominion over animals to justify their lack of concern for animal welfare.

I have personally encountered self-professed Christians holding this opinion. I have NOT met any Hindus, Buddhists, or followers of other religions with similar views. That´s not to say they don´t exist, just that I´ve not encountered them.

To be fair to KM, I DID only mention Christians in my post and I can see why she may have thought I was only criticizing one particular faith.

pinta

Post   » Tue Aug 27, 2002 5:05 pm


Hmmm. A higher power is something mystical and unexplainable to me. Forces of nature is just nature. The floods in France I wouldn´t attribute to a higher power unless the French have been up to no good......okay, maybe nature is a higher force....

I don´t like the idea of a higher power as a being simply because it requires imagery that cannot represent all. Like the fact that God is always imaged as a white male. Too corporate boardroom to me. This excludes too many. I´d rather think of a swirling mass of energy than some person with arms and legs and genitals...........interesting concept.....does God have genitals or is he like Ken (Barbie´s guy). Uh oh....going to hell now......

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