"Questran/Food Mix & Carafate"

imanut4u

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 8:52 pm


Oh, these are Tori´s pigs? Sorry, I had assumed these were the dumps at Animal Control we spoke about.

"I wouldnt ask for help, and surely wouldnt ask another rescuer for help."

Tori, that´s really not a good thing for a another rescue to read. When you get in over your head, and need help, it´s best to look for it.

Having taken in pigs from an overloaded rescue myself, I can say that I have seen first hand how easy it is to get over your head trying to help needy animals. I´ve seen pigs from a rescue in poor condition long after they should have been in good shape.

The ones I took in had mites, were thin, dirty and scruffy. They recovered in just a few short weeks of a balanced diet, clean conditions, adequate cage space and ivermectin.

This same situation also resulted in several pregnant sows delivering once they reached their new sanctuary, sows that should NOT have been pregnant when they left the rescue. Carelessness resulted in more pigs being born.

It´s hard to say no, but it´s harder to swallow the fact too many are difficult to properly care for. I sincerely hope you keep your numbers down now that you´ve lightened your load.

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 9:25 pm


It´s hard to say no, but it´s harder to swallow the fact too many are difficult to properly care for. I sincerely hope you keep your numbers down now that you´ve lightened your load.

Are you saying they received the poor care at my house? Because I had too many to care for? What? When I said I wouldnt ask another rescuer for help if I was mistreating them, I was meaning, why would I want someone to know I was neglecting them, if that was the case? Which it wasnt. If I didnt care about those pigs I wouldnt have carried them to the vet and spent all my time and money on them. I was totally overloaded when I had them, I know that, but that doesnt mean I didnt care for them to the best of my ability. I love those pigs as much as love the ones that are still here. No matter how tired I am or how burnt out, they still got veggies 3 times a day, clean cages, and hay, pellets and water throughout the day. I cant believe I have to explain myself, I wouldnt mistreat an animal for anything.

imanut4u

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 9:55 pm


Tori, as I explained, I didn´t realize these were your pigs. No need to be defensive. I´m sure you did do the best that you could.

I was sharing my view point on not asking for help --- I´m sorry if I misread what you meant. It appeared you would not ask anyone for help.

I was just expressing my hopes that you will keep your numbers down to a manageable amount. I know you are new to the rescue scene and it´s easy to get in too deep too fast.

I didn´t mean to offend you.

Some questions if you don´t mind -- with nine pigs it´s getting confusing. Trying to help Rachel get the ducks all in a row before heading off to the vet tomorrow.

To my understanding, the mother has been with you since December, what has the vet said about her? Any treatment at all? This is the sow on Similac? Why?

There were two litters correct? When were they born?

How large was each litter?
Did some passed away?
How many?

Which litter are the boys from?
And the sow?

You had told me that pups were deformed .... which litter? Are these the deformed pups or did they pass away?

Which pigs are on which meds?

Were the boys able to pass stool at your house? Were they normally formed?
There is concern with their stools and lack of on arrival, but it seems that is getting better already.

Anything else you´ve had done at the vet would be appreciated as well.

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ladyveg

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:10 pm


I should post because it looks like there was some initial confusion, Heather and possibly others may have thought that these were pigs brought in from Animal Control and in that situation, the first thing you do think is neglect. I was trying to be as objective as possible in describing the pigs so that we could maybe get somewhere in figuring out what was causing babies to die suddenly and causing the problems that were happening.

Tori did call me tonight and tell me the yellow bellies were staining from Similac baby formula with Iron. I never used formula on my son, but I do know that that iron stuff stains. I´m wondering if the high iron content may have caused those tiny black misshapen turds? When my son is on an iron supplement his bowel movements become darker and he becomes constipated.

Tori also told me that the 3 small boars were only 2 oz at birth, could that explain how tiny they are now?

If a pig is bald, is it pretty normal to grow back in on the stomach last? I was worried about uterine cysts etc. because the fur on the rest of her came in so nicely.

Finally, those three babies are extremely wild and afraid of me. One took a pretty chunk out of my finger. Could this be that they are feeling pain somewhere or maybe just because of their mom being in such bad condition when pregnant?

I am hoping to get to the bottom of any physical problems with my vet, but it´s really confusing. Tori knows I couldn´t keep straight a lot of what she told me about all the different litters and who died.
---
And I forgot to mention that Tori brought along the Bactrim and Carafate, we are doing the Bactrim but not the Carafate. She also gave me Critical Care. I already had simethicone but am still looking for a dose.
Last edited by ladyveg on Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Evangeline

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:22 pm


Why are they on Bactrim? And who is?

Some babies died? From what?

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:30 pm


To my understanding, the mother has been with you since December, what has the vet said about her?

I didnt take her to the vet on Thurs. I didnt think any of them were ill, they had no signs, I just did that as a precaution since one died with no apparent symptoms. Since she was the littermate to the one that died, I took her and since the boys were cagemates, I took them.

Any treatment at all?
she was on antibiotics when I first got her as a precaution, since she was in such bad shape when I got her and she was on Ivermectin for the mites.

This is the sow on Similac? Why?

No. Dee Dee was on formula because she wasnt nursing like she should and I was worried about her.

There were two litters correct? When were they born?


2 litters, and I said this already, and I also said they were born on the 22nd and the 25th of Dec.


How large was each litter? 4 pups in each litter

Did some passed away?
Yes

How many?

One at 10 days old. Then, Cuppy.

Which litter are the boys from? the one born on the 25th

And the sow? the one born on the 22nd


You had told me that pups were deformed .... which litter?

Both litters, IMO. Except the pigs born on the 25th look normal now.

Which pigs are on which meds?

Tom, Jerry and Dee Dee

Were the boys able to pass stool at your house? Yes.
Were they normally formed? Yes

Anything else you´ve had done at the vet would be appreciated as well.

Are you taking them to the vet? I have explained all this to Rachel. I took the meds, and Critical Care to her. I hope she posts soon to verify this, I dont want anyone thinking I am blowing smoke. The also received subq fluids at the vet. Their coats have all grown back except for Teddies belly, so I am assuming the Ivermectin worked, and the mites are gone.

And, to tell me not to get defensive, come on. Look at what was said about how I cared for them. I did everything I could for them, I know that. They were treated very well here, I am so sorry if anyone thinks differently. I cant help where they came from, where all this crap originated from. The Moms were so mite ridden and malnourished and dehydrated when I got them, what can one expect when they have their babies? They were here a week when they birthed, in that time they had unlimited amounts of food and water and a clean home, treatments for the mites and atb´s. I did my best to get them healthy, but I dont know what I could have done to make the babies any better. I tried my best, but the damage was already done before they came to me. The babies were almost full term when they got here, already formed, so I couldnt do much to change their health in utero. I cant believe I have just been put through the ringer like this. I did everything I could to make the Moms healthier before the babies came.

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:36 pm


Rachel, I brought the Sulfatrim, not Bactrim. You had the Bactrim, and the meds I brought were what the vet prescribed. LOL Like this isnt confusing enough.

imanut4u

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:40 pm


Am I taking them to the vet?

Hmm, nope, just trying to help Rachel get the story in order so she has accurate info. The emails are piled up and we thought this might be the fastest way to get the answers rather than weeding through. You can help or you can hinder, your choice.


Cuppy passed away recently? He´s related to which pigs? The three boars Rachel has?
He showed no signs? Were his bowls normal?

Is there any reason why these pigs had small stools? (none during the trip) Were their stools normal before leaving? Stress of the trip?
Last edited by imanut4u on Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ladyveg

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:46 pm


Sorry for the confusion, Tori. Sulfatrim and Bactrim are the same thing. Now I have to get to bed! LOL

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:48 pm


Sulfatrim and Bactrim are the same thing.


LOL I didnt know that. I am a mess. I thought I was helping LOL.

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 10:51 pm


Cuppy passed away recently? He´s related to which pigs?

he is related to the one with Bloat, Dee Dee.

They have small stools I am assuming because they are small pigs. They all ate, drank, peed, and pooped here.

imanut4u

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 11:03 pm


Okay, so is this correct?

Teddy - pups born 12/22
DD
Max, Cuppy, the 10 day old pup

Cierra - pups born 12/25
Libby
Tom, Jerry & Doodlebug
Last edited by imanut4u on Sun Feb 10, 2002 11:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 11:16 pm


yes

imanut4u

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 11:18 pm


From Nicole:

"Without any warning, two of them crossed the bridge between last night and today."

Cuppy and _________ from the same litter or one from each litter?

Evangeline

Post   » Sun Feb 10, 2002 11:40 pm


Wait. I´m not good at maths, but aren´t we missing a baby, here?

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Mon Feb 11, 2002 12:00 am


Wait. I´m not good at maths, but aren´t we missing a baby, here?


Nicole made an error, Max was adopted.

Here is the list one more time LOL

TeddyBear´s Babies 12/22

one nameless baby, she passed away at 10 days,

Cuppy, he passed away last tuesday

Max was adopted.

Dee Dee

Ciera´s Babies 12/25

Tom
Jerry
Doodle Bug
Libby, who lives with mom pig

imanut4u

Post   » Mon Feb 11, 2002 12:02 am


Oh okay, that clears up that question. Thanks

Nicole again "Without any warning"

Was it Cuppy being syringe fed then?

Wheeks R Us

Post   » Mon Feb 11, 2002 12:07 am


Was it Cuppy being syringe fed then?

Everyone except Doodle Bug and Libby were syringe fed at some point and the vet said to give them all the atb´s and the other meds. I now know she doesnt know what she doing and I wont be going back to her for anything. I did give all of them, meaning all the babies the atb´s the first night, but none after that.

The story of Cuppy dying is, I fed and watered everyone and they were fine, a few hours later he was face down in the cage and everyone else was wheeking at me, I picked him up and he was gone. Thats it, eating and playing and wheeking one minute and gone the next. No signs of illness at all.

imanut4u

Post   » Mon Feb 11, 2002 12:12 am


How many pigs did you take in all together from the homeless woman?

Were you able to foster any out?

Are there any others with problems?

Trying to rule out any possible contagious illness vs. genetic problems

Nicole

Post   » Mon Feb 11, 2002 12:16 am


"From Nicole:

"Without any warning, two of them crossed the bridge between last night and today."

Cuppy and _________ from the same litter or one from each litter?"

Tori had told me, in the same email, about the baby dying at 10 days old and about Cuppy dying. I, somehow, misread and posted wrong. She told me before that Max (?) had already been adopted.

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