Hind end/back injury

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:41 pm


We got a call from an animal control about a guinea pig that was surrendered yesterday and looks like it's injured. I'm wondering if there is anything obvious I should be looking for based on her symptoms?

Sorry I don't have time to do a search as I leave work in an hour and am picking her up tonight, I have no internet access outside of work. I will try to find a way to access GL at the vet though, maybe over the phone with a friend.

I think I'm going to pick her up and take her to the vet's for x-rays, but am not too sure if there's anything else I should be looking for or asking about.

Here are her details (second hand, I have not actually seen the pig yet):

7 month old female, dropped or picked up by hind legs by child

She seems to be able to push herself forward a bit with her back legs although they drag, her bum is being pushed forward by her legs it sounds like, they also say her abdomen isn't being lifted off the ground

Front legs work fine, she can walk in a straight line and get around her cage well, although her front feet are red and swollen

She is eating and drinking fine; does not appear to be in obvious pain

She is urinating and pooping, although her poops look wet and she is urinating on her legs. Her poops also may appear to be getting stuck, they are not sure if she has control over her bowels

Also, her eyes are a bit crusty and her skin is flaky, probably unrelated but thought I would mention it.

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salana
GL is Just Peachy

Post   » Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:28 pm


Is she chewing on her hind feet? It seems like every pig that's done that after a back injury has painful spinal cord damage. When was she dropped? Some kind of anti-inflammatory, either a steroid or an NSAID, will probably help.

Check her for a UTI, which she probably has if she's sitting in her pee.

She probably has mites and possibly a URI too.

ChadWPB

Post   » Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:32 pm


Wow. All that and she's only 7 months old. Poor little sow.

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:35 pm


Salana, that's the one question I asked that they missed answering. Unfortunately no one knows when she was dropped. I will dose her with Metacam as soon as I pick her up.

I will make a note of the UTI possibility too, and will dose with ivermectin tonight depending what the x-rays say.

Will check in later if I can manage it, thanks for the quick reply.

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:28 am


The guinea pig (now called Megan) got an x-ray last night and it was determined that there are no fractures anywhere. The vet couldn't see anything obvious and said it could be a bruised spinal cord or nerve damage. My friend will be taking pics of the x-ray and I will hopefully be able to post them in a couple of days.

The woman who described her condition to me got it spot on, she is not really dragging her feet, but they are somewhat curled under her body. She almost looks like she's in the fetal position in her back end. I'm wondering if this couldn't be solely the result of the mites and the pain she's in from them?

She is not chewing on her feet at all. She squeaked in pain when the vet touched her legs and moved them around. Especially it seemed when he tried to straighten them out.

Her mites are terrible. She's got that thick, scaly, white crust that has been posted here before. She has a lot of hair loss, but no scabs or open wounds. The skin that doesn't have the white crust is very inflamed looking, bright reddish pink. She also has crusty eyes, but no unusual breathing sounds as of yet.

The vet gave her an injection of ivermectin, as well as an injection of 10 mg of Depomedrol. Comments on the steroid would be welcome.

He says I'm not to give her any more steroids at home, as this med is long lasting and will cover her for 4 weeks. I need to know what pain meds I can use in addition to this though, as I'm sure she's still in some pain.

I have also started her on Baytril. I gave her Vitamin C this morning, as well as 9 ccs of sub cue fluids. She seemed very dehydrated, and did not poop at all overnight. I fed her 10 ccs of pellet mash, as well as 5 ccs of water. When I put a bowl of water out for her after that (I think she couldn't drink from the bottle properly) she started drinking on her own. She did perk up a bit after the feeding and fluids.

I think I will make a cart for her based on the Roxy Roller thread in Reference asap. I want to bathe her tonight as she reeks, but I'm so scared of hurting her. The sub cues were a disaster, she screamed in pain the whole time, it was terrible.

I have her in a small carrier at present to hopefully limit her movement. She's got her hay, food and water right in front of her. I will try to do more research today and figure out if there's anything else I can do for her.

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snowflakey
E's Moriarity

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:45 am


Poor piggy! If you can bear the smell, you might should wait on the bath until the ivermectin has kicked in, since the bath would probably hurt her terribly. She may need a fungal bath or treatment with Program, too, if fungus is present. I guess the squeaks of pain are a good thing, but how heartbreaking! If you make a cart, post pictures.

I don't know what pain meds can go with that steroid, but hopefully someone with the knowledge will pipe up soon. There is a recent thread here started by ladyveg (rescued very sick, mitey pigs) and I think there is a mite/steroid/pain med discussion on it.

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salana
GL is Just Peachy

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:08 am


I don't know how long the steroid will last, but it's good that she has one. It'll help both with the back thing and the mites. You shouldn't give NSAIDs with it, of course. I think she could have a narcotic if the pain is still bad, but since she's apparently not eating too well, I'm not sure if that would be good.

It's bad that her legs hurt, but good that she can feel them and that she's not chewing on her feet. Hopefully this is a temporary injury.

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salana
GL is Just Peachy

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:13 am


Oh--I think "Depo" is a generic sort of term used for any injection that's supposed to last a long time, e.g. Depo-Provera.

I looked up Depomedrol and found this page, which says it's a prednisolone derivative.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:55 am


I'm glad you're going to try to help this pig. Taking care of the mites will make a huge difference. Good luck to you both.

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snowflakey
E's Moriarity

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:05 pm


Oh, folks, would a fungal infection make a pig smelly? Alice didn't post what kind of smell (generic dirty pig smell or something else), but the description of her skin sounded bad, and perhaps a skin infection is present. Any thoughts?

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:14 pm


Oh, definitely possible. Could be antibiotics would help. If she's seen a vet, the vet should be able to tell.

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leebee

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:37 pm


Alice, although she smells, I think you should probably hold off on bathing her until the mites are better. Just touching a pig with mites that bad can induce seizures, plus it is absolute agony to them.

If you think she might have a fungal infection, I'd give her some Program (although double-check that it can be given with the steroid). I don't think it is a fungal infection, it sounds like the typical really bad mite infestation. Every pig I've seen with an infestation that bad has had that white crust.

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:15 pm


snowflakey the smell is definitely urine, her skin on her back doesn't smell bad at all. The vet thought the flaky junk was the result of mites, didn't think it was fungal.

I wonder if she doesn't have scurvy? I'm just reading over the info about it on the main GL site and it sounds very similar to what she's suffering with. Poor thing, she's probably got a mixture of everything.

I will not bathe her, thanks for the input on that. I don't want to cause her any more discomfort than I absolutely have to. I'm printing off all the info about Itchy and Scratchy, as well as ladyveg's recent thread, for reference at home.

I'm hoping the baytril will be sufficient to cover any skin infection, UTI, URI, etc. that may be present. I'm considering a combo, though I'm not sure if I should go with bactrim or doxy in addition to the baytril. Doxy seems to be more recommended for URIs, but bactrim is more recommended for UTIs. There wasn't enough nasal or eye discharge to do a proper culture, and we were so focused on the other stuff we neglected to take a urine sample.

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:17 pm


I emailed my dad the info about the cart, so hopefully we can get started on it. I'm excited about that, but nervous about putting her in it what with her skin being so sensitive. I think the harness thing may hurt her. Not sure what to do, what should take priority at this point.

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snowflakey
E's Moriarity

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:27 pm


I guess she could have scurvey. 50 mg of C couldn't hurt, and it seems to help scurvey pretty quickly. Poor poor girl. Chance had scurvey and so did Para's scurvey girls.

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snowflakey
E's Moriarity

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:31 pm


Chance and Scurvy Girls

Lots of ranting, as you would expect. Somewhere in there might be interesting symptoms.

Josephine
Little Jo Wheek

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:38 pm


Hmmm... maybe Valium (diazepam)? I haven't used it much and it can slow the GIT down? since it is a benzodiapene (controlled substance). It is used for sedation, anti-itching (anti-puritic), anti-seizure, appetite stimulant, etc. It will help relieve some pain if the pig is in a lot of pain. You can't use much else with depomedrol.

Program is fine to use with steroids and won't hurt. I'd also supplement the vitamin C (at least 50 mg/day). I woudn't worry about the cart until you get the skin under control. She should probably be bedded on something she can get decent traction on and something that is very absorbent. The Baytril is good for possible skin infections or urinary tract infections, etc. I wouldn't give her the full whammy of abs unless there was a specific indication.

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 3:11 pm


The diazepam sounds good in a number of respects - itch relief, pain relief, appetite stimulation - but bad in the sedation, GI slowing respects. She's already pretty conked out most of the time. I'll have to see how she's doing when I get home and make a decision based on that.

Thanks for all the help and input, I will update tomorrow morning when I get to work.

Josephine
Little Jo Wheek

Post   » Tue Feb 22, 2005 3:18 pm


The steroids should help, too. Especially in the itching department.

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AliceMcmallis
Supporter in '08

Post   » Wed Feb 23, 2005 10:06 am


Megan seems to be doing well this morning, relatively speaking. There were two huge globs of gross poo in her cage when I got home yesterday, and a smear of diarrhea later on in the evening. But this morning there were a bunch of wee hamster type poos.

She seems perkier in general. I'm still holding my breath, waiting for something really bad to happen, but I think she may be on the road to recovery as far as the mites and other problems go. She was even making those little happy clucking noises while eating some hay last night! :)

I think I'm going to hold off on the Valium for now as I'm a bit nervous about the sedative affect. She's just starting to eat more on her own and I don't want to mess with that.

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