Reba: Satin w/arthritis, bone loss, & teeth issues

pinta

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:56 am


How much calcium supplement is she getting and in what form?

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:20 pm


She has been on the 75mg calcium lactate twice a day that I pulled from your info in the reference section. She has been on this since you pointed it out in the beginning of this thread.

The vet is now suggesting switching to Tums to see if the change in type makes a difference. She suggested 1/4 pill once a day but I saw where the reference thread talked about 1/4 pill twice a day, so I am wondering if it should be the higher dose instead?

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 4:11 pm


Keep in mind calcium works together with other minerals. Ask if it would make sense to do a multimineral supplement.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:19 pm


ARE there any safe brands of multivitamins that I could use? I thought they were all bad. I am currently adding B, C, and calcium to her mash, which is made with KM's pellets, a little oatmeal, and some unsweetened applesauce. The vet wanted me using KM's pellets more often than CC and this recipe is providing the best results as far as how much of it she will eat. I can usually get about 40cc down her in one meal with this stuff. She eats a lot less if she isn't as happy with the taste.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:22 pm


You want a multi-mineral supplement. Not all vitamins. Skip the vitamin A and some of the other stuff.

I am just guessing at this. See what your vet thinks about how to best handle the calcium loss.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:40 pm


The only suggestion the vet had was switching from calcium lactate to Tums. Beyond that, we have talked about the fact that there are people on here who have studied it intensly and she requested I collect input from them regarding all of these issues and then bring the info to her to review. So I am hoping Pinta and the others can find the time to give me some input. I am printing up the major threads on here about it all but she wanted to see some specific responses about Reba, based on the x-rays and history I provide. Especiallysince the calcium lactate seems to not have worked.

I am trying to get some more detailed copies of the x-rays to replace the ones I posted earlier. I took pictures of them the way Para told me too but they seem darker than others I see on here. I sent the original pictures to her to play with and I may try the scanner too.

I am hoping salana will come back and explain what she is seeing in the x-rays about the ribs, so that I can try to visualize it myself.

pinta

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:25 pm


Hmmmm - if it was my pig, I'd up the calcium. I know pigs given smaller amounts haven't had a huge change but did start to get more density when they went to the larger dose. I would up it by another 75mgs daily. But this is just what I would do and doesn't mean it's right. The sunlight could make a difference. As we speak my pigs are outside and they usually spend warm days outside so the sunlight might have been really helping Shiraz, but I didn't realise it.

As far as I know, Calcium lactate is the most readily absorbed by pigs. But this could be an individual pig thing and maybe the Tums would work for Reba. We're all pretty much going by the seat of our pants.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:33 pm


Thanks pinta. That is the kind of info we are looking for too. What is "right" may not make much difference at the moment. We want to knw what others have done/are doing that seems to be helping even in the slightest.

I think I will try the larger dose of Tums for starters.

I am still looking for high density calories for her, to try to get some weight back on her. For the last 2 mornings she has been at 670 before breakfast, up from 650. But I also spent the entire weekend doing pretty much nothing but feeding her. Unfortunately, I can't do that every day.

pinta

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 6:38 pm


I should clarify that I would up the calcium lactate by 75mg.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:38 pm


Oh, I guess I misunderstood that. So 225mg daily of the lactate? I think the Tums dose would still be higher. Does the dose depend on the type? I know some things are that way, like iron. You need a lot fewer mg of some irons to equal the mg of others as far as effectiveness, if that makes sense.

I have no problems with using the higher dose of lactate if it is really felt that it is the better choice. It does concern me tho that the 150mg daily dose still allowed so much damage to occur.

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Becky

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:12 pm


I use a full spectrum reptile bulb. It's a Super UV coil lamp, 13 watt. I'll do a search and come up with the specific info on the numbers for the type of light it should be. It's not just any old lamp, and not a plant light.

Also, they're only effective for 6-12 months. Even though they still look like they're fine, they're no longer giving the type of light you need.

Interestingly, I'm taking my Elvis in for x-rays this weekend. He's very gradually been losing weight again, so I want to see what's going on.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:25 pm


Thanks Becky. as soon as you give me the specifics I will track one down. If you know an exact brand or such then please pass that on as it will make my search easier!

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Becky

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:49 pm


Man, I spent too much time looking and I got logged off. Bye, bye light bulbs! Oh, well.

OK, natural sunlight has UVB at 290-320nm and UVA at 320-400nm. You're trying to match that as closely as possible. If you look on the packages, it'll give you a range by nm.

I'm on a new computer, so all my old bookmarks are gone, but I found all of the reptile info by Melissa Kaplan. For reptiles, she suggests Durtest Vita-Life bulbs or Zoo Med's Reptisun. Either way, you need to make sure the bulb provides both UVB and UVA light. Don't just look for full-spectrum. Look for specific numbers and types of rays.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Tue Apr 04, 2006 11:26 pm


Don't forget about the possiblity of using a human preparation like Fosomax to build the bone back up. Studies of humans claim calcium alone won't do it -- weigh bearing exercise helps some. We can't get our pigs to work out.

There's some drug you only use once a month being pushed on TV. I would guess these are real possibilities for building bone back up so long as cautions are followed.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Wed Apr 05, 2006 12:36 am


Fosomax has a once-a-month dosing now I think. I think there are others out there too tho. I will have to talk to the vet about the possibilities.

Thanks Becky. There is a Reptile only pet store not too far from me. My son would be thrilled to go and drool over all the creepies, so I will have to grab him and see what they have in the way of lights.

pinta

Post   » Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:20 am


I don't know what's in Tums or how much calcium is in a tablet but the fosomax sounds like a good idea.

It seems if there are no bladderstones after all the supplementation so far, they aren't likely to be an issue.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:35 am


I believe there is 375mg of calcium carbonate in 1/2 of one of my Tums.

pinta

Post   » Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:28 pm


But if it isn't readily absorbed it may be the equivalent of a lot less. Need those chem people to comment.

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Becky

Post   » Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:59 pm


I don't know about Fosamax. The dosing has to be just right, and if I'm not mistaken, it has to be taken on a completely empty stomach. Not sure how that would translate to guinea pigs.

Mamabear, have you looked into calcitonin? We were going to try it on Elvis before we found out that the calcium lactate seemed to be working. It's a hormone that takes calcium out of the blood stream for use in the bones. It's been used very successfully on other animals, but not on guinea pigs to my knowledge.

mammabear66
With a Touch of Insanity

Post   » Thu Apr 06, 2006 12:39 am


Do you mean it hasn't been tried on pigs yet? I will see what I can find on it and talk to the vet. Thanks.

She has pretty much maintained the 20 grams she gained but has not gained more andhas been arguing about eating some today. I don't know yet if it is because she is eating more on her own in the cage or if there is something wrong causing her to not want to eat. I will have to see what her weight does. Pray for the little piggy diva.

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