Yipes! Poor Nina has a badly swollen foot!

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:25 pm


I soaked it in extra warm water, what looked like dirt or poop came off leaving an open sore. There was some whitishness there but a small attempt to see if it could be removed resulted in lots of blood so I rinsed it and put a bandage on (all I have) which she has so far left alone.

I'll see a vet on monday. Wondering if there could be an abscess that needs stuff removed, would there be lots of bleeding?

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Lynx
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Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:26 pm


Gave her some bactrim I had (probably not the best but it's all I have at the moment and I know it must be infected).

I think Josephine said culturing it is best in which case maybe I should not until seen by vet. I'll see if I can get some chlorhexidine anywhere tomorrow.

Poor Nina. It was a shock to see it all swollen. I wonder if I missed it.

Evangeline

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:31 pm


Gak!
Sorry, I have virtually no experience with foot injuries, but I would have done the same as you did. When I had to deal with abscesses (not on feet, though) and was flushing them out, pus would come out at first. When blood alone came out, it meant there was no pus to be flushed anymore.

Now, why do these things always happen on the weekend???

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Lynx
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Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:38 pm


No kidding. I guess I wondered how much blood is normal and if an abscess can happen in the foot pad. And where do I get chlorhexidine? Is this a Walmart kinda thing? Does it come in a 1% solution that you dilute 10 to one with water or ????

Any advice appreciated. I'm going to have to get either some of that newskin or some tape and gauze I guess for wrapping. The bandage I put on is still there. and some new triple antibiotic ointment? This is BNP, right?

Man, I am such a wimp.

Charybdis

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:41 pm


I flush abcesses with a diluted povidone-iodine, which you can find at a drugstore.

When flushing, I have noticed some whitish tissue down in there even after all the pus has been squeezed out (E is right, blood can be a good sign). I think this might just be necrotic tissue. Usually I can tell if there is pus in there because it will have lumpy pockets underneath the wound.

Pinta has said, I think, that nu-skin is not good for open wounds. I would stick with cleansing and dressing with bnp.

The betadine can be diluted until it looks like weak iced tea.

Evangeline

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:45 pm


I use diluted betadine, too.

I don't know if you're thinking of my post, Chary, but I'm the one who said the LIQUID Nu-Skin wasn't good on open sores. The gel pad things are designed to go on open wounds, such as cuts or burns.

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Lynx
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Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:45 pm


By the way, I used the spare heavy ceramic food bowl to soak the foot. It's nice because it doesn't have a tendency to tip and you don't have to get the whole pig accidentally wet.

Ever bought any chlorhexidine?

What I saw looked white/peculiar. It didn't lend itself to coming right out so maybe it was part of the foot. Maybe I should just stick with soaking.

Charybdis

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:53 pm


Yes, chlorhexadine is available as "chlorhexaderm flush" in the feed stores out here. The flush is supposed to be for ears but you might be able to use it otherwise. It costs about $14 U.S. dollars for a bottle. The ingredients are:

water, glycerin, isopropyl alcohol, nonoxynol-12, PPG-12-PEG50 lanolin, PEG-40 castor oil, clorhexidine gluconate, fragrance, FD&C blue #1. It may contain citric acid.

I have only found concentrated chlorhexadine at the vet.

However, I'm not sure if it would be the best thing for an open wound. I've had great success with the povidone-iodine (betadine).

Evangeline

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:54 pm


Ever bought any chlorhexidine?
Not me, sorry.

Charybdis

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 10:56 pm


The povidone-iodine says that it is a "topical antiseptic microbicide," and the chlorhexaderm is a "topical antimicrobial cleansing/drying solution."

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Lynx
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Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:01 pm


I think Zoe used chlorhexidine. Yes, the ingredients you listed in the flush, don't sound too hot.

Poor Nina.

Charybdis

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:10 pm


Chlorhexadine is used for bumblefoot a lot. I use it for that, too. But for open wounds/abcesses, I use diluted Povidone-Iodine. For deep abcesses that keep closing up, Dr. R asks me to add in a little peroxide to keep skin from healing over the abcess.

But with a lot of blood, it doesn't sound like an abcess. Usually I don't get blood out of an abcess until I've squeezed a good deal of pus out.

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Becky

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:29 pm


Poor little girl! Do you think she might have cut her foot?

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:42 pm


I think it's possible. The other foot -- I can't quite tell if it looks normal or if something is starting. I think pigs put up with alot. The last couple of days I thought I noticed her breathing more sharply but didn't know if it was my imagination. Now I wonder if it was pain. There was nothing else she did differently.

I guess this means if your pig is acting at all unusually, you should at least give them a once over.

Charybdis

Post   » Sat Apr 05, 2003 11:48 pm


Right about that! I picked up Bastille a couple of days ago and looked him over because he hadn't drank as much water as the other pigs since the night before. He had a large oozy abcess on his lip.

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Cara

Post   » Sun Apr 06, 2003 12:08 am


It's amazing how well pigs hide their problems though. I hope Nina will be just fine. Why is that pigs wait until the weekend or the wee hours of the morning to not feel well!

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lisam

Post   » Sun Apr 06, 2003 12:14 am


Poor Nina! How frightening for you. It always goes that way, you think that everything is just fine, then BOOM!

A brand name for chlorhexadine is Nolvasan. My horse vet has me dilute it ten to one. There are different kinds--it comes in a wash, in a wound cream, in a disinfectant too, I think. I have been using it to clean out Dust Bunny's abcess.

Good luck! Let us know how it goes.

kleenmama
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Sun Apr 06, 2003 12:21 am


And feet bleed alot! When I was first getting pigs, Melinda pulled off what she thought was a piece of poop on one of her pigs' feet. Wrong. It was a spur. Bled like a son of a gun. Pressure usually makes it stop.

And of course, it's a weekend. Has anyone EVER had a pig have an emergency at noon on a Monday-Friday?? Not me.

Julian
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Sun Apr 06, 2003 3:39 am


Never.
They know my voice at the ER clinic. Everthing seems to happen after hours. I just chalk it up to Murphy's law.

Blood is much better than pus in a wound. A culture is worthless once you've started antibiotics.

You can get Betadine over the counter but I believe Nolvasan is by prescripton only or from vet supply companies. I've always gotten mine from my vets.

I know the flush is highly diluted Nolvasan. I had the undiluted with the chemo pig and it needed to be diluted about 10 to 1. It makes it a very light blue rather than an bright bue. Undiluted Nolvasan is used as a vetinary cleanser and surgical tool disinfectant. It is way too strong for wound use that way.

Blood with no puss sure sounds like a cut rather than an abcess.

pinta

Post   » Sun Apr 06, 2003 6:30 am


This is a common problem in pigs with poor circulation. A poop gets stuck on their foot and the skin reacts to it, ulcerating underneath.

My animal physical therapist recommends aloe vera. If you have a plant, break off a piece and squeeze the gel right on the wound and then wrap it.

Combined with the sharp breathing, I would say Nina could be a candidate for Enacard or Fortekor. Any other peculiarities like Pea Eye, weight loss, inactivity, chronic URIs?

Peony has easily ulcerated feet that take overly long to heal (currently sporting 3 bandaged feet) and can't keep her weight on. She has Malocclusion from TMJ and has recently developed Pea Eye.

I have noticed that most if not all my heart pigs have also had to deal with malocclusion. I believe the malocclusion is due to them not working their teeth enough. With bad hearts they have to make a choice between breathing and eating.

With all these red flags we put Peony, who will be 7 in July, on Fortekor. She has only been on it for a few days, but I am noticing a better activity level and less weight loss overnight. Hopefully we won't need Lasix as well. She has just come down with a URI, most likely because of a compromised immune system. But she is eating well, in good spirits and the lungs are almost quiet after 3 doses of Doxcycline.

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