I'm worried about Rosie.

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Thu Oct 23, 2003 10:07 pm


Rosie is our oldest boar. He's supposed to be 6 or 7 years old. He was dumped here as a scrawny, blind, almost dead, lethargic "sow". We found out he was a boy, got him a companion cagemate, and started feeding him healthy foods (for the first time in his life, apparently).

His cataracts reduced, he can now see and hear us, he gained 250 g (to 875g), became more active, and developed a fully grown in healthy looking Peruvian coat.

Three days ago we noticed he wasn't eating his night time veggies. Two days ago we noticed not as many poops in the cage, and picked him up. Crusty eyes, honky breathing. URI, started treatment with Bactrim (this is the third time he's been treated for a URI since June). He has lost almost 100 grams in the last week. He also stank. Like shit. Literally. I've never smelled that before. I gave him a careful bath and trimmed his coat (so it wouldn't drag the ground) and he took it all pretty well. The next day, he stank like shit again. I don't know what this means but I've never smelled it on another pig.

We've been handfeeding a slurry of Critical Care/Pellets/Healthy Poops/Baby Rice Meal/Baby Food/Vitamin Supplements, and Pedialyte. He appears to be eating nothing on his own, and isn't pooping. I've been stimulating him (stomach rubs, gently rubbing the anus with warm water and a Q-Tip, and cleaning him out whenever there's poop in there. He doesn't seem to mind.

I've never had an impacted boar here so I don't know if what I'm seeing there is normal. It appears to be goopy poop, but there are "strings" of weird mucous stuff in there that almost reminds me of what worms in a dog look like. I have to pinch it with some tissue and pull it out of him, almost. Doesn't really seem to smell.

When he first started acting "not right" I thought it was due to the loss of his cagemate, who got adopted last week. He is now in a cage with a divider through which he can see other pigs, but he doesn't get along with anybody else we have so we can't put him in with someone else. I was hoping he could hang on until our new pups got weaned, and I was going to see if anybody from this new litter would work with him.

I noticed tonight that he was trying to eat veggies and spitting them back out. I took them back from him, stuck them in a blender until they were shredded really fine, and gave them back to him. He tries to eat them and spits them back out. He does not appear to have used his water bottle, eaten any pellets, or any hay in days. I grabbed him again to look at his mouth. No injuries, but his bottom incisors appear to be almost 3/4" long. I've never seen incisors that long.

Somebody tell me what they think is going on with this guy. Most everybody who comes through here is young - Less than a year old, around a year, or pregnancies and pups. I dunno what the heck to do with a geriatric.

User avatar
Cara

Post   » Thu Oct 23, 2003 10:21 pm


Not to be a smartaleck but taking him to the vet would be a start! Malocculsion? (sp?) Impaction?

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Thu Oct 23, 2003 10:28 pm


I'd think malocclusion also. Could be an oral abscess that smells bad.

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christina

Post   » Thu Oct 23, 2003 10:53 pm


Has he seen a vet? for exam for malocclusion?

the post caught my interest as I have a Rosie (now officially known as Roosevelt-but I call him Rosie)--HE was a "sow" left left by his owners at a local rescue. When I got him home we discovered he was a boar. He has malocclusion and has had some mouth ulcerations, but no weird smell. Is it coming from his mouth?

He also has had that stringy mucous coming out in his soft poo/diarrhea. So I know what you mean. He had it before when he wasn't eating well. The vet said it was mucous and there wasn't any specific treatment for that given that I am aware of. He has taken antibiotics for diarrhea and bacterial enteritis in the past.

If he isn't pooping at all, does he need some Reglan to get his system going? Sorry I can't be of more help. I hope your Rosie feels better very soon.

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Thu Oct 23, 2003 11:35 pm


Taking him to a vet at 10:00 pm wasn't an option. There are no 24 hour guinea pig savvy vets that I would trust here, not to mention that I could afford.

I posted because I was trying to get some information that might keep him alive for the night, so I could take him to the vet in the morning.

I called Kleenmama who walked me through my first ever subcue (on the phone!) and he seems to be feeling better. She said that he might have gone too long without eating and that his organs might be shutting down or might have already shut down.

We gave him the subcue and some more food, and he seems ok. He keeps doing this involuntary muscle spasm thing that has me worried. He jerks a few times a minute, for no apparent reason.

Even if he has molar malocclusion I don't think he would survive a surgery as he is so anorexic. I'm going to the vet in the morning to see if they will give me more subcue supplies (I only had the one) and see what they think. I'm scared to lose him.

pinta

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 12:43 am


If he's had 3 URIs since June he may have heart disease.

Trimming the incisors without doing the molars is useless. the molars are probably overgrown forcing the bite apart and allowing the incisors to overgrow. He could have tongue entrapment. Dentalwork is a necessity if he has malocclusion. Otherwise he will starve to death.

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SandraVE

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 12:56 am


My Moki has bouts of really smelly, but very firm poops. I have never figured out why or what sets it off. She gets the same veggies as everyone else, eats lots of hay, and yet she is the only one who smells bad on occasion. I know it in a minute when it starts. The smell even permeates her fur all over. She has been diagnosed with idopathic pericardial effusion, but I have absolutely no idea if any of this is even related to her condition. She is doing great right now. No problems since she was diagnosed last winter. The only thing that comes to mind is that for some reason her food ferments in her gut for some reason.

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:26 am


Pinta, I was thinking that too. Until I noticed his behaviour tonight I thought we just had a run of the mill URI to deal with. Of course, nobody ever seems to crash during the day when you can take them to a vet. He slept on the bed with me for a few hours, wrapped up in an old bathrobe. He woke me up rooting around trying to tell me he was too warm. I guess that's a good sign. He is now in his cage with a thermacare pad under an old towel in his pigloo. We will see what the vet says in the morning if he makes it. Right now he's just sitting in front of his water bottle, staring.

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:27 am


Sandra, what is the idopathic pericardal effusion, and what is the treatment for it? What you describe sounds exactly like Rosie... The smell permeating all over the skin, even after bathing. I've never smelled anything like it.

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 3:53 am


He seems a lot better just now. I woke him up in his pigloo for feeding. We placed him in a cage next to our sow that just delivered, and we allow the baby pups to go back and forth through the barrier to visit him. When I woke him up, there were two pups in there cuddled up next to him. I'm hoping that close contact with other pigs will help pull him out of the "I am giving up" mood.

He was happy to be woken up and took 12 cc's of Critical Care/Pellet Mash and 3 cc's of Pedialyte. Still no poops, but his stomach is not hard, distended, and doesn't seem to be uncomfortable to him.

I have a question, though, about his penis. I have never extruded a penis all the way. He is a longhaired pig and one of the usual checks I do is a palpation of the penis (especially for longhaired pigs, as they can get hair wrapped around the penis, causing an infection or blockage). I have successfully extruded and cleaned blockages of other boar penises, but I never had to extrude them very far to get to the site of the problem.

Rosie was very dehydrated, and when I felt for his penis earlier tonight (under the skin), I felt what felt almost like TWO penises under there. But I couldn't get it to extrude at all because he was too dehydrated. Just now, though, after his feeding I tried again and was able to get it to come out. My questions are these:

1) how "long" is a fully extruded penis? I've never extruded one on a boar that didn't have a problem already just to check to see what it looks like. I do remember our fostered pig Bear, who used to get erections on Baytril. I seem to remember his penis being over an inch long, but that was erect. I don't think that's a good comparison.

2) This is kind of gross, but what is the visual skin texture supposed to look like? The tip of Rosie's penis is dark pink and shiny with moisture, but then it changed.

I got Rosie's penis to come out about 1/4". There appears to be a crusty or pasty yellowish material coating the entire penis once you get past the tip. I was unable to clean it off without a helper to hold the pig, since holding/extruding took all my hands. Is this pasty stuff normal, or could this be an infection or a sign of another problem? If his penis isn't out all the way, should I try to make it come out longer to make sure he doesn't have hair or some other sort of material blocking him? I am worried because KM said that if he has hair tightly wrapped around his penis, it could cause his kidneys to shut down since he wouldn't be able to eliminate.

Sorry for the really graphic questions, but I am just trying everything I can. I have not noticed (noticed, not positive though) that he has urinated all day today.

Thanks.

pinta

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 5:23 am


If there was hair wrapped around his penis, it would be most likely swollen. The yellowish crap is probably semen or possibly detritus from urine. It can be gently rinsed off with warm running water. Ferd gets this all the time and is pretty used to being held under the faucet. Where's Alex? Can't he help you?

The semen can dry around the penis and make it swell. Gentle cleaning is the fix. This happened to a boar of mine once, forcing the penis outside the body. I had the vet clean him out since I figured he was so sore at that point he needed professional hands.

I'm sure the penis length varies from pig to pig but they probably all think they have 2 inch penises.

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 5:29 am


Hee hee. I will have Alex help me clean Rosie's penis when he wakes up at 7. I'm up working and have nothing better to do than consider guinea pig penises and I am sure that Alex will be thrilled to hear that first thing. Ah well. :)

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Paravati
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 7:01 am


His weight has gone from 765g to 796g in 24 hours. There was even a little tiny spirally pile of poop in there when I went to go feed him a minute ago. And his towel is wet, so he has been urinating. He even had the energy to rumble at Mrs. New Mama Sow when she came to check him out at the grid barrier. I think he might be doing better. I am exhausted, waiting on Alex to get up so we can do his penis cleaning and I can finally go to bed for a few hours. Going to see the vet at 11.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 7:53 am


Only 2"?
Could also be a yeast infection (the yellowish detritus). Can you tell if he's been peeing?

This odor, can it be excess special poops being eliminated (Sandra)? I understand if a diet is too rich, the pig may produce more special poops which are indeed stinky.

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PauloF

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 8:24 am


Only 2"?

Lynx, that should be expressed in piggy inches, not "regular" human inches. I guess most women would be scared to death facing something similar, considering the actual proportions.

I feel humiliated...

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 1:57 pm


they probably all think they have 2 inch penises

It's all in the mind, anyway.

Hey, I just found out a friend of mine and her family (husband and daughter) will be in Sao Paulo for a couple weeks mid to late December (sister getting married). She's excited about going. From Bolivia but speaks Portuguese.

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smiley
Just Do It

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 3:25 pm


So size does matter. ; )

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PauloF

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 4:08 pm


Maybe this is why Lynx considers her DH as a GOD...

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smiley
Just Do It

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 4:12 pm


LOL. Good one Paulo.

kleenmama
I GAVE, dammit!

Post   » Fri Oct 24, 2003 8:23 pm


I think the stuff on the penis is normal, Ollie's is goopy too. I have no idea on average length. Not sure I want to know.

How are they doing tonight? What did the vet say about the URI's?

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