Anyone Read, or Reading, Mueller's Report?

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Mon Jul 29, 2019 3:30 pm


Just got it in the mail today, all 743 pages of it.

bpatters
And got the T-shirt

Post   » Mon Jul 29, 2019 4:01 pm


I'm planning to, just haven't had the time to start it yet.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Mon Jul 29, 2019 5:03 pm


I have listened to the podcast:
Mueller Report Audio

It is free but they ask you to share and contribute if you find it valuable. While I have a difficult time sitting and reading these days, I can listen.

There is actually a lot of repetition of the facts. Which are devastating.

Bookfan
For the Love of Pigs

Post   » Wed Jul 31, 2019 2:15 pm


Well, if you guys are reading it, I guess I'd better.

I thought the highlights of Mueller's testimony were Nadler's opening remarks, Schiff's opening remarks and Schiff's final 5 min. of questions. Rapid fire and effective with fairly emphatic answers from Mueller.

User avatar
Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Wed Jul 31, 2019 7:13 pm


It's going to be a little hard to get through it, but I'm starting on it this weekend.

User avatar
Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Wed Jul 31, 2019 7:29 pm


I think some people like a paper copy so they can highlight and book mark various topics/areas.

Probably much easier to whack a conspiracy-muddled dis-believer with a book than an e-reader :-)

Bookfan
For the Love of Pigs

Post   » Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:32 pm


I just saw this:

https://www.justsecurity.org/65863/expert-summaries-of-muell ... Introduction

It might make it easier to get through. The editors who I'm familiar with are top notch. I'm not worried about distortion.

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Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:59 pm


Very important indeed to be familiar with the report!

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Sef
Supporter in 2019

Post   » Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:03 pm


Thanks for the link, Bookfan. I want to read through that as it looks like it could be very helpful. The Report itself is daunting and I'm only making very slow progress with it so far.

GPIG

Post   » Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:31 am


Regardless of Trump, although he is relevant, a point of constitutional protocol that just seems incredible to be interpreted the way it's being interpreted:

"The U.S. Justice Department has a decades-old policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted, indicating that criminal charges against Trump would be unlikely", according to legal experts.

Rationale: In 1973, in the midst of the Watergate scandal engulfing President Richard Nixon, the Justice Department’s Office of Legal Counsel adopted in an internal memo the position that a sitting president cannot be indicted. Nixon resigned in 1974, with the House of Representatives moving toward impeaching him. “The spectacle of an indicted president still trying to serve as Chief Executive boggles the imagination,” the memo stated.

OK wait a darn minute here. I have sat on a Grand Jury, It was one of the best experiences of my life. I learned so much about the criminal aspect of the constitution and why we do the things we do. The whole point of True Bill / No Bill by a Grand Jury is so that one person or group can't target another because of political, religious, social etc beliefs and tie them up in Criminal Legal Proceedings. To get and indictment, you need a crime with evidence pointing to the person to be indicted. Now it's not perfect, we all know that. The term you can indict a ham sandwich although not really true makes a point for debate.

There is absolutely no reason the president should be above the Grand Jury process. The Grand Jury in our Constitution is the real omnipotent group of the whole shooting match, as it was intended by the Framers, with good reason. The power should never not be in the hands of the people

The record shows the framers were anxious regarding their work on the Grand Jury process and did indeed understood it was a tad incomplete. However, they gave us the tools to change what they had given and what they hadn't given us, because they were brilliant and without ego (at least for the authoring of the Constitution time) and understood several things

1) they had to complete the damn document at some point and couldn't debate forever and 2) they most clearly understand their time would be different from future generations in ways they could not predict. NRA nuts also take notice of this.

User avatar
Lynx
RESIST

Post   » Thu Aug 22, 2019 9:58 am


"The U.S. Justice Department has a decades-old policy that a sitting president cannot be indicted, indicating that criminal charges against Trump would be unlikely", according to legal experts.

That's not entirely true. It is being pushed by the current toady in charge of the Justice dept, but it is not clear. Other legal experts dispute it.

Here's commentary by a recognized scholar, lawyer, and professor focusing on American constitutional law:
https://www.lawfareblog.com/yes-constitution-allows-indictment-president

Bookfan
For the Love of Pigs

Post   » Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:34 am


"current toady" ha!
I haven't read your article yet but from following Tribe's twitter feed, I know his opinion on this.

And the opinion of a constitutional lawyer is important here because of the situation GPIG refers to relating to Nixon. "The Justice Department adopted in an internal memo" - that hardly seems settled law. I also recall Rachel Maddow going into great detail about this & I forgot how, but somehow involved Spiro Agnew (who was a real crook) & keeping him from succeeding Nixon as pres. It was decided on the specific situation.

From the organization that brought us the summarized Mueller Report I linked to above:

"Just Security has compiled significant documents in Congress’s various Russia investigations dating back to the 2016 election cycle. This collection seeks to include significant original source materials including letters, subpoenas..."

https://www.justsecurity.org/62240/congressional-russia-investigations-document-clearinghouse/

I found this on:
https://twitter.com/rgoodlaw

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