*URGENT* Passing blood...squeaking

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User avatar
Sef
I dissent.

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 9:34 am


Update: I sent another urine sample over to our local vet this morning to test again for crystals. No crystals present, no white or red blood cells, but the vet said there was quite a bit of bacteria present. He wasn't sure how much of this to discount as contamination, but said it was "all the same type" and in amounts significant enough to make him think it's not contamination. Vets here don't seem to know how to do a cystocentisis...I'm thinking a free-flow sample would have been better than syringing it up from a clean surface, if we're looking at bacteria, but at the time I was more concerned with the "crystal" issue.

Vet thinks maybe we should do a round of Baytril, since we already tried a round of Bactrim and are still seeing issues with crying while defecating. He said this could be a kidney problem rather than just bladder infection, and pressure on the abdominal walls when having a bowel movement would cause discomfort.

Urine was diluted; 10-15?

At any rate, the vet made a comment that I'd like some input on. He said that there were some tubular casts -- Hyaline? I'm not sure I understand what this is or what it means. Can anyone here comment on this?

Thanks.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:01 am


Josephine will have to comment on the tubular casts.

The bladder is small but fairly easy to find. If you have any xrays available, it would position it well for him to know where to do a cystocentisis.

User avatar
Becky

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:08 pm


pressure on the abdominal walls when having a bowel movement would cause discomfort.

This is what my vet said, as well, except he said bladder instead of abdomen. Since the bladder is chronically inflammed, she tends to have pain when eliminating either urine or poos.

I had to Google tubular casts. This is what the article said about why the test is performed:

Why the test is performed:
The test is performed to see whether the kidneys are functioning properly and to check for certain conditions, such as kidney infections, glomerular diseases, and interstitial kidney diseases.


I also keep wondering whether or not they can get polyps or the human equivalance of hemorrhoids. That certainly would explain the pain and occassional passing of small bits of blood in my pig. I asked my vet and he said he didn't know.

User avatar
Becky

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 12:31 pm


OK, this site talks about the various types of casts. It looks like Hyaline casts are protein. I believe they look for protein in the urine to test for kidney function? It also says some casts in the urine is normal, so clarification would set your mind at ease, I'd imagine.

http://www.drkoop.com/ency/93/003586res.html

User avatar
Sef
I dissent.

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:49 pm


Thanks again, Becky. This whole thing is getting so frustrating. First it was a UTI so the exotics vet put him on Bactrim, then she said his cecum looked "impacted," so she put him on a motility drug, and then she said he should try Metacam for inflammation but managed to get the dosage wrong, then she said his urine had crystals in it - both struvite AND calcium oxalate! some feat! - and that "treatment is going to be very tricky but told me increase vitamin C, and now our regular vet looks at the urine today and says no crystals, no blood, no white cells, but lots of mysterious bacteria and casts.

I'm just about at the end of my rope, here.

User avatar
slfalzone

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 2:17 pm


Hang on to your rope there sef. I'm at the end of mine too! Maybe if we tie them together we can make a hammock and relax for a second Sigh. Wouldn't it be so wonderful if we could take our piggies to the experts on this forum? I'm convinced they'd be well in no time.
Are the 'mysterious bacteria' being sent for culture? I had no idea that these little piggies were so complicated did you? It's quite scary, but I'll be thinking of you and Zachary.

User avatar
Sef
I dissent.

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 2:46 pm


I like the hammock idea! My luck, I'd break my stupid neck trying to get in or out of it.

Well, the urine isn't being cultured, which is what I think needs to be done. We need a clean sample, but our "regular" vet is NOT an option for a cystocentisis (he's the one who found the casts today), and the exotics vet was reluctant when I asked about it last month. The fact that, when Zachary peed on the table and she didn't know how to "scoop it up" (I told her to go get a syringe and draw it up!), doesn't exactly warm me to the idea of her sticking a needle into him.

I'm just getting so tired of being told this and that by the idiot vets here, and then having to spend days researching it myself just to make sure they have it at least semi-right. It has reached the point where I'm paranoid for them to do ANYTHING without me double- and triple-checking it. I don't even want to think about what happens if one of the boys needs surgery...

User avatar
slfalzone

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 2:54 pm


I know it's so frustrating - and even more so because you can't write your own prescriptions or order your own tests. I know that they go to school for years - I have such respect for that, but I also think they should listen to ideas and options and stories of what has happened in other pigs. Take a deep breath. do your best and hopefully that will do the trick!

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Mon Feb 20, 2006 6:23 pm


Can you summarize the whole thing, present it to your vet, ask for a reevaluation and suggest he get on Vin for advice?

User avatar
Sef
I dissent.

Post   » Wed Feb 22, 2006 11:16 am


Well, here is where things stand. (Mind you, this has been going on since Christmas Eve.)

Our "regular" vet called me this morning, saying he had consulted with the "exotics" vet who has been postively worthless up until this point (the one who first said it could be colic; then mis-dosed the Metacam; then said there were crystals showing up in the urine - both kinds! wow!). The exotics vet feels that we need to do a culture on the urine to determine what kind of antibiotic to use, since the regular vet found "significant amount of bacteria" in the urine sample I took over there this week. The regular vet said, "Of course cystocentisis would be the way to go [first smart thing either of them has said], but it's difficult to do this in a guinea pig and would require anesthesia." I think not.

Finally he said we could get a "reasonably" good sample if I use something called a collection swab kit. He said this has something on it to help preserve the bacteria...less chance of contamination. I have not heard of doing this, and am wondering if there is any advantage to this, over my having syringed up the urine and put it in a sterile container?

He also didn't mention the casts to the exotics vet. Either he forgot, or didn't think it was important. I don't know enough about casts to even ask anything intelligent.

At present, Zachary is active, appetite and fluid intake normal, no blood in the urine, no crystals, no white blood cells in the urine, only occasional squeaking when defecating but not when urinating. Poops look normal. Weight is holding steady at 2 lbs. 10 oz. After the stress of dragging him repeatedly to the vet, he now has mites which I'm treating. Poor little guy.

Can someone please comment on the collection swab thing, and also the presence of Hyaline casts? (for example, what constitutes a normal amount?). Also, any thoughts on what bacteria in the urine would seem to suggest? Would a blood panel be of any value at this point?

Thanks again.

User avatar
Lynx
Celebrate!!!

Post   » Wed Feb 22, 2006 12:40 pm


Write Josephine. Maybe she can comment on them.

User avatar
Sef
I dissent.

Post   » Wed Feb 22, 2006 1:20 pm


Done. Thanks, Lynx.

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